Why the Carnivore Diet Is Helping MILLIONS of People Worldwide!

[Music] Welcome. I'm John the carnivore teacher and today I am honored to welcome a man who is challenging and changing the way the world thinks about food. Dr. Anthony Chaffy is a medical doctor, neurosurgical registar, former professional rugby player and one of the most outspoken voices in the nutritional space. For years, he has been educating audiences worldwide on the science behind an animal-based diet, dismantling mainstream nutrition myths, and exposing the hidden dangers in the foods we've been told are healthy. Uh he's known for his bold, evidence-based claim that plants are not the safe, benevolent foods we think they are. In fact, he says they've been trying to kill us all along. Today we're going to dig into exactly what he means by that, how plant toxins work, and why he believes the carnivore diet is the optimal human diet for health, longevity, and disease prevention. So, buckle up people. This is going to be an eyeopening conversation that might just make you rethink your next salad. Dr. Anthony Chaffy, welcome to the interview. >> Oh, well, thank you so much for having me. It's a pleasure. >> Absolutely. All right. So, number one, let's get right into it. The big claim you have famously said, >> plants are trying to kill us. >> That's a provocative statement. Can you explain exactly what you mean and the science behind it? >> Yeah. Well, I mean, it really is a is a quote from my professor of cancer biology when I was going to University of Washington in Seattle. And so, he actually was the first person to sort of break through with us where he had already taken botney biology. I understood about plant toxins, how they have about a million different defensive chemicals, anti-nutrients, toxins, hormonal disruptors, so many other sorts of means of defenses to stop animals and insects from eating them because they're they're alive and and they like to stay alive. So all living things have defenses and their defenses are largely chemical in nature. And so this was put into into the the the the um perspective of the foods that we eat because you you learn about how toxic all these plants are, but of course that doesn't apply to the plants we eat. Those are edible plants and these non-edible plants, those are the ones with poisons in it. In fact, they all have poisons in it. It's just that we have more or less defenses towards certain toxins in certain plants so that we can eat them more or less safely. But even then most of these plants can be quite harmful if not treated properly. So there are a lot of plants that that we use we call edible that are not edible in their natural form. They have to be treated. They have to be even soaked and boiled, cooked or or treated chemically with uh lie or or um sodium hydroxide um ash clay different sorts of things. Fermentation all of these different different traditional ways of preparing plants. These are all for a very good reason because this lowers the toxic load and increases the bioavailability. So when you when you throw all that away and just go to like a raw food, you know, um sort of vegan approach, you you can actually get hit with a full brunt of these toxins and be you can get quite sick from that. Um and that's that's not good. So our professor made this point to us and we were very taken aback by that. But he was telling us that Brussels sprouts had 136 identified carcinogens. This is back in early 2000s. Mushrooms had over hundred and spinach, kale, lettuce, celery, cabbage, cucumber, broccoli, all the different fruits and vegetables that we would eat on a on a regular basis had dozens if not over a hundred known carcinogens and that they were quite abundant. that there was there was work going back to well a lot of work but um one was from professor Bruce Ames from University of California Berkeley in the late 80s early 90s where he showed that well they were talking about getting rid of all these pesticides and he sort of pointed out that we've been using these pesticides for decades without any sort of problem. So the new rise in health issues in the 1980s really shouldn't be caused by uh the pesticides because those had already been in practice. Um, and so he did some studies and he actually found that the natural occurring toxins in those so-called edible farm products were far and away more toxic than the pesticides that they were studying at the time in this particular study, AAR, which they spray on apples and other sorts of things. And they found that that the natural naturally occurring toxins were 10,000 times more abundant by weight than the pesticides we were spraying on them and that they were hundreds of times uh more likely to cause cancer in in lab rats. So we were very takenback by this. We're very blown away. And I remember thinking I was like he must be joking. This has to be this just there's something else going on here. And I remember thinking like, well, you know, the vegetables are still good for you though, right? Even, you know, you know, even with all that. Um, and he just sort of took a look at us and he just said, I don't eat salad. I don't eat vegetables. I don't let my kids eat vegetables. Plants are trying to kill you. And it just really, really hammered that home for me. I'm like, yep, okay, no more plants. And that was my litmus test was if it had a plant, I wasn't going to eat it. So, I sort of naturally defaulted into eggs and meat. Um, since then I have I've looked into this much more deeply and and found that he was extremely on you know ahead of his time and he was very very well ahead of his time and behind his time because you know 100 years ago we knew this you know you read nutritionist such as Adele Davis who's a very famous nutritionist he said you never eat spinach raw you only poach it in milk you have cream spinach spanopita with you know feta cheese and things like that because they have these toxic oxalates in there that are very harmful to your health. And so if you poach them or cook them with dairy, the calcium in there draws out those oxalates and and neutralizes them so that you can eat this stuff more safely. So we actually understood about plant toxins much, you know, more previously. I mean, for thousands of years, this was this was a very important part of of nutrition was understanding which plants were harmful and how to lower uh that that that harm. So when I started looking into this more and more, I found just more and more evidence of this. I mean there's botnists and biologists from Cambridge, from Texas, from all over the world that have lectures up on I mean there's on the Cambridge University uh YouTube channel actually called Cambridge ideas. There's uh there's a lecture there from or a video from uh uh professor John Parker who's a professor of botany is head of their botanical gardens there at Cambridge or at least he he was and this was done back in 2011 I think but his t the title of his his video is just called don't eat the plants and he's just talking about all these plant toxins how harmful they are to human health and that they're a really bad idea to eat and that and he even concludes at the end like okay so what do you eat you know well if you want to eat real food without all these spines and hairs and toxins and all these other sorts of things, become a carnivore, just eat meat. You know, that was his conclusion. And that was long before we had the carnivore movement that we have now. So, you know, this is not this is not uh a fringe opinion. This is this is mainstream biological and botanical sciences. And that's what I've been trying to just bring to bear because it's been so overshadowed by the very non-scientific nutritional epidemiology mostly funded by the food and drug companies like Pepsi, Coca-Cola, Nestle, etc. Coca-Cola alone in 2015 spent $119 million. >> Wow. >> on nutritional research. So they spend far more than any other uh other sector um you know them as a whole the processed food industry and you can you can just guess at what the the um the conclusions are. It's I mean they Coca-Cola had a study that said oh you give Coca-Cola to mice and they lose weight. Oh look at that Coca-Cola is a diet drink and I was like give me a break. You know this is fraud. You know it's just marketing. Yeah, >> they have frequency questionnaires where they ask somebody to try to remember what they've eaten in the last four years and as if that could ever be accurate and then say that well pizza can sometimes have meat as a topping. You get a you know Big Mac meal with fries and the drink. Well, that has a little sliver of a meat patty in it. So all that's meat. Pizza's meat. Fast foods meat. Anything that has an ingredient that's meat, we're just going to call that meat. And people eat less meat, they seem to be healthier, you know, in this fake study that, you know, that cannot be accurate because you're asking people to remember what they every meal they've had for these course of years. Um, and it's it's so it's completely biased and these things are largely funded by the processed food industries and uh or or different sorts of ideological groups that that push a more plant-based diet either for commercial gain or just because of their own ideological bent. you know, you have other researchers that are are vegan activists, self-described vegan activists like Dr. Gardner from from Stanford. And so, um, who has described himself, you know, as a as a big proponent of veganism regardless of, uh, nutritional, um, value. So, that's what you have to contend with. This is the hard science. Bonnie is a hard science. Biology is a hard science. Nutritional epidemiology is junk. It's junk science. You can publish this stuff, but it's garbage. It is fraught with confounding factors and personal biases. You look at McMaster who published a pure study, same same uh method methodology, food frequency questionnaires, but you know, they didn't do it in a biased um biased way that that intentionally muddied the data that they collected. And so they actually found the exact opposite of what people at Harvard like Walter will with the nurses studies um have have put forward saying no you need to stop eating meat and all that sort of stuff. First year medical school really quickly. We were we were we went through the nurses studies uh that uses these food frequency questionnaires. of the first things to use that uh professor Willlet sort of uh popularized that methodology of of doing nutritional um studies and we were we were told straight away that you know the only it you can only that sort of epidemiology it can only generate a hypothesis saying hey look at this I'm seeing this trend okay let's test it let's see if it's there's actually something there and whenever you tested any of their suppositions um from the nurses study that they said, "Oh, look, this is what we found." Whenever they were tested experimentally, they they came up uh as not um not being accurate. And so it's it's it's nonsense. And so, you know, this is being pushed for a political agenda, for um a financial agenda and um ideological agenda. And it but it's not the hard science. The hard science is that plants are living organisms. They do not want you to eat them, and they absolutely have defenses. And you can take that for granted at your own risk. >> Wow. Absolutely. I I totally agree with you 100% as you've taught me and many other people have taught me. Now, um the people that I'm trying to convince some of the people that ask me questions. All right. What are you mentioned oxalates? All right. I had a kidney stone. I've been through that. That's when >> the attention it's that's when it slapped me in the face. You know, what are you eating that caused this? Um, and sometimes people don't think about going carnivore until they have a tragic event that happens to them. So, can you tell my audience other than oxalates, what are some of the other toxins that we're talking about like lectins and phitates and stuff? Well, I mean there there are thousands, tens of thousands, actually close to a million different defensive chemicals that that plants make that we have have, you know, categorized and classified and even named, right? So these are there many of these things and certain certain categories, right? So it' be like lectins you mentioned there. There are many different kinds of lectins, thousands, tens of thousands of the different kinds of lectins. So gluten, people talk about that. There's wheat germma glutin that's a lectin. anything all lectins can glutenate. So that's why it's called wheat germaglutin which means it makes things stick together. So you have this these sort of >> yeah you have these villi in your your your intestines and have these microvilli little finger-like projections that come off of that that massively increases the the the receptor area and the the absorption absorptive uh surface area of your gut. um gluten, wheat, German gluten and a glutinates that so these little finger-like protections stick together and you see people what ciliac in particular they can have these things stuck together but then they get damaged and they actually go away and they get they get destroyed right but anybody will have that stickiness it'll all stick together hemogluten and that will get into your bloodstream and stick your red blood cells together and start making them sticky tacky and and increase your risk of clotting um so there's many of these things your body does react to um and and elicit an an immunal response to them because they are damaging your normal body physiology and anatomy and so your body does react to them. Um and so they can elicit you know a large inflammatory response. Lectins for example are are strongly implicated in in causing autoimmunity and this has been argued in published literature and peer-reviewed literature since the earliest I found was 1991 was a Dr. Freed who published a paper looking at this and arguing that these autoimmune diseases that we call autoimmune diseases that he said that that your body attacking itself actually has never been proven and that's true. >> Um it's just that and and the and for your body to attack itself without any intermediary um it would have to um it would have to satisfy certain conditions which are not satisfied. But he said that the the known effects of lectins in your bodies, these plant lectins, because there there are other lectins too, but they're specifically plant lectins, >> that those are known to satisfy all of those preconditions. >> All right. >> Right. It's just that we we looked at these things by as we put an autoimmune stamp on it and now we just look at from this frame of autoimmune. This is autoimmune. We need to treat as autoimmune. What if it's not autoimmune? That's outside the box thinking. Okay, the box is autoimmune. There's no there's nothing else it can be. Well, what if it is? What if it is something else? Right? And so that's what Dr. Frerieded was arguing and that's certainly what I've seen. When you remove lectins, you remove these these plant foods from people's diets, autoimmunity goes away >> dramatically. And we know this with I mean this is even in the literature with with celiac. Celiac disease is is a is an autoimmune disease towards um gluten we germaglutin. Right. So, but it's it's it's consider it's called a gluten mediated autoimmune disease, right? Well, if it's if it's mediated by something else, probably not an autoimmune disease, right? So, what happens is you you get this wheat germaglutin, it glutinates your your your gut and your body reacts to this and responds to this to say, "Hey, get the hell out of there." So because the gluten is stuck to your cells and your body's attacking that gluten that are stuck to your cells, your cells get damaged and so you start destroying your gut lining. But the the the important part there is that when you stop eating gluten on biopsy, you can see that the gut heals completely within four to six weeks even though the antibodies stay elevated for up to 3 years. >> Wow. >> Right. So those are not auto antibodies. those are not attacking your body because your body's still there. >> That didn't change. So gluten's not there anymore. And so over time saying, "Okay, we're not seeing this threat anymore. We're going to start creeping down, creeping down, creeping down." But then you eat gluten again, bam, they shoot right back up because that's what they're responding to. And that's how your your body works. Excuse me. So that's what I see in all autoimmune conditions, especially the ones that we can measure their antibodies such as Hashimoto's. I I have over 100 patients with Hashimoto's thyroiditis and which is the leading cause of hypothyroidism. It used to be iodine deficiency, now it's Hashimoto's. So in those patients um when they're able to stick to a very strict carnivore diet especially just beef, lamb and water because those ruminant that ruminant digestion can ferment and break down these toxins. Again fermentation that's a good way of getting rid of these plant toxins opening up bioavailability of these nutrients that they are able to break down a lot of these toxins so they don't filter through. Whereas a pig or a chicken or a fish, they're monogastric. They don't ferment their food before they absorb it. And so if they're being fed plants that they're not designed to eat either, more of these toxins can get in their body, right? And they'll filter out a lot of those things with their liver, etc. But some of it can slip through and that can that can be a problem for some people that are very sensitive to um to these substances especially. So when they're able to do that, invariably I see them massively improve their conditions. So auto these sorts of conditions that we call autoimmunity, which I argue are not autoimmune. I have a I have a lecture online. It's called rethinking autoimmune diseases or autoimmunity whatever and um I sort of make all these arguments but you know whatever call it Hashimoto's um you're you have the inflammatory attack that's damaging your thyroid right now and you need to stop that. But also that has damaged your thyroid to the point that it's nonfunctional or at least less functional. And so those are those are two different things. And so that's why people get put on thyroid medication, but then they don't really have anything to do for the damage that's being done. They basically just say >> eventually it's going to die. Your thyroid is going to be destroyed and you're going to have to be on medication the rest of your life and we'll have to surgically remove your thyroid because it it it's a cancer risk at that point when it gets completely dysfunctional. So when you put people on a carnivore diet, it stops the damage even though the antibodies can stay elevated, >> but the thyroid is much slower to recover than your gut lining. And so it can take months to a year or two before you can actually get um a significant level of healing or or complete healing. And so during that time, you might see you might still need uh thyroid medication. Certainly, you wouldn't wouldn't come off of these things without doctor supervision, but you I often see them needing less and less and less medication as long as they're strict. And over time, their thyroid antibodies coming down, the TPO and TG antibodies are coming down for Hashimoto's. They just come steadily down. But it's like the it's like the celiac where it takes a couple years sometimes depending on how elevated they are. But they do come down. I've seen them drop hundreds and hundreds of points after people have been very strict lion diet, beef, lamb, and water for, you know, eight months or so. It's dropping hundreds of points down to very, very low levels. and and so but you know depending on how high you are you know it could take longer than that but either way if this theory that I have is true and and Dr. Freed shared with me is true that it's actually the lectins causing the problem and the damage and your body's attacking those lectins then either way you can have elevated antibodies but they're not damaging yourself and hopefully they're not and that's what we see. We see their thyroids improving as their antibodies are coming down but they don't have to get to zero before their their body starts improving but then they eat anything else. those antibodies are there waiting vigil and as soon as they come in bam you have this big reaction you get a lot of damage. So lectins are one of them. Lectins can do all sorts of things in your body. They can mimic different um hormones in your body like insulin. So lectins can bind to insulin. Yeah. They can bind to insulin receptors. >> Yeah. Five times more tightly than insulin can. And so even when people are ketogenic, but they're eating, you know, these lectin containing vegetables, non starchy vegetables, they can actually get this big um insulin response even though their insulin is is completely normal. So it's harder for them to lose weight. And this is and there have been studies that shown like ketogenic diets, you lose you lose a significant amount of weight, but then you have a ketogenic diet that removes lectins and they they lose even more. And this is why a lot of people from the ketogenic um way of eating have come to carnivore, which is a ketogenic diet, but it's just a sort of a more another step down that path that they they end up, you know, maybe hit a stall. They massive improvements, health is getting so much better, but they sort of hit a stall. They can't quite get rid of that last little bit of weight and improve their health in certain ways. They get rid of the plants and just that's just the the floodgates open on their health improvements and weight loss. So, that's another thing they can do. They can also, lectins also block um a hormone called leptin, which is a aratiety hormone that can make you feel like you you're starving and it slows down your your if you're if your brain can't see your leptin, your brain basically thinks you're starving to death because leptin comes from your fat tissue. And so if your brain thinks you're starving to death, it's going to tamp down your metabolism so that you can't really lose any use much of your body fat and it's going to really up your um hunger signals. And so it causes you to overeat and it causes you what you do overeat causes you to store that predominantly not use it which is which is important because this can make you gain more weight or make it difficult to lose weight. And I do see people that have difficulty even on carnivore losing weight 100% of them have high leptin and um and so going on a on these carnivore diet can help lower that leptin. Very briefly for for listeners, the six main things that can can block leptin are um insulin blocks leptin, fructose independently blocks leptin, alcohol blocks leptin, lectins block leptin, um and then stress. So uh cortisol, cortisol will block leptin. So high stress or poor sleep, if you get average 5 hours of sleep a night or less for seven nights in a row, it can actually give you pre-diabetes from the amount of cortisol that goes up. Um, and so it takes a full seven days in a row of 7 to eight hours of sleep um, to undo that. So it's it's it's has a significant impact on you. And then funny enough, blue lights. So specific frequencies of blue lights not coming with the rest of the frequency of the light coming from the sun like coming from your screens, coming from LED lights, fluorescent, those sorts of things that can actually block leptin at the level of the hypothalamus. So all of these things um, need to be optimized in order to get your leptin down. And as that and it can take months and months and months for your leptin to come down, but eventually it will and weight will just shed off. Some people seem to be able to lose weight even with elevated leptin. Don't know why, but 100% of people that can't lose weight or don't or lose weight very slow or more of a slow burn. 100% of them I've seen have high leptin. So that's something that if you're having trouble and you check your leptin and it's elevated, should be under five for men and women, then you might you're just in that category. there just going to be a bit of a slower burn, but eventually that will come down enough and it will it will just start streaming off you. So there many other things as well. I mean there cyanogenic glycoides that that when you chew them, this is this is why is a very clear defense because when you chew these things, it releases two chemicals that form hydrogen cyanide which is toxic to all life, >> all known life. And so that is a kill switch. So the plant's saying, "Okay, you're eating me. You're crushing me up. You're chewing me. I'm going to kill you, too. I'm going to I'm going to dump out all this cyanide to try to hurt you." And so things have more or less of this. About 3,500 different plants that we know of that have cyanogenic glycosides to varying degrees. But things like cassava, there's sweet cassava, bitter cassava, and and bitter cassava has so much cyanide that it will kill you >> and kill an adult. But this is the main staple of 750 million people in the tropics that you know that that's their number one calorie source, right? This is number three overall calorie source in all of the tropics. >> So it's a really important staple diet. This is this is something that that very poor people are sort of forced to eat because it's available, it's cheap, but it has to be processed properly to lower that toxic load. Then there's um sweet cassava that doesn't have as much nearly as much um cyanide. So it's it's edible and you can eat it as it is, but there is cyanide in it. And the bitter cassava, you don't get rid of all the cyanide in it. It only lowers it significantly. But lowgrade exposure to cyanide over time, can cause very serious organ dysfunction, thyroid dysfunction. It it um blocks iodine from coming in your thyroid. I would say quitrogen. There's entire category of plant calledrogens that stuff up the functionality of your thyroid. which is another reason when people go carnivore their thyroids improve because you get rid of all these grogens. Um cyanide um can is a cyanogenic glycosides are grogens as well but they also damage the electron transport chain in your mitochondria globally. So they can damage all of your tissue and especially sensitive to this is is your neurological uh system. So you get neurological damage as well as thyroid damage and multiorgan damage. eventually you can die if you completely stop your prevent your cells from making enough ATP. Um so almonds, sweet almonds and bitter almonds um as little as 40 or 50 sweet almonds a day can be enough of a dose that eaten chronically can give you those long-term chronic delotterious health effects in an adult and we're giving this stuff to children regularly. I remember my my brother's doctor in the '9s said, you know what, one thing to do to to be on or early 2000s be on top of your cholesterol is eat almonds and and other nuts because they have um these uh phytoestrog or phytosteriles which are plants version of cholesterol and our body can't use that properly but it signals our liver to make less cholesterol. So this lowers your cholesterol. So, um he was told to eat 35 almonds a day ongoing and that would keep his his um his his cholesterol down. Okay. So, that's right at that border of actually giving long-term serious uh harm from No. And this is this is this is well documented by CDC, WHO, um FDA, etc. They really don't consider there's any real safe level of cyanide to consume. And yet we don't put labels on these things because it's it's natural cyanide. So it's it's it's fine if it's natural cyanide. If it was if it was industrial included or got in there somehow we have to say warning this contains trace amount of cyanide. But because it's natural >> you don't have to do that. Um, and you know, could you imagine like no one would ever buy these things, you know, if it said like, you know, cassava chips, you buy packets of chips with a cassava in it, right? Or veggie chips, tapioca, that's comes from cassava as well. Tapioca pudding, tapioca flour, those sorts of things. So, it has a lot of these cyanogenic glycoides and uh and just almonds as well. Can you imagine like if we put that just say, "Hey, warning. This can this has even a low amount of cyanide. Don't have more than this many ounces per day ongoing." You know, people just going to look at that and be like, "How about I have none of that ever?" But but that is what they should be doing because it is dangerous. Now, now having a few almonds, is that going to kill you? No. But having a handful of almonds every day ongoing can absolutely build up hormones that they eat. >> Absolutely. Yeah. And so that's the thing is that that's the entire point of this is that it's like not plants are trying to kill you in the sense that they're just going to, you know, stick a gun to your head and you're just dead that second if you eat them. Now, most of the 400,000 plant species that we know of in the world will cause an acute reaction that will make you extremely sick or even kill you with just a very small amount. >> So, North American water hemlock, that's the most poisonous plant in North America. And half a leaf can kill an adult, right? blocks the GABA receptors in the brain which are the sort of the the uh the calming receptors in the brain and so you get your brain uh gets over excited and you get seizures and so you die of intractable seizures within 2 minutes and and you can't stop them right and not even that you'd have a chance to being out in the woods or something like that you know one to two minutes you're dead right so you know these things are highly toxic most plants on earth will kill most animals even herbivores that excl exclusively eat plants. They eat very specific plants because they have the defenses towards those plants, but other plants will kill them. And we even have this in um these these names for these diseases in in um veterary medicine. Uh because livestock costs money. Humans are basically we're we're valuable when we're sick because we have to go pay for a treatment. Cows are valuable when they're healthy and putting on weight. And so when they start getting sick, losing weight, and dying, okay, people are losing money here. So like, okay, what the hell's going on? So they actually figured out that there are a number of these diseases like big tongue, big head, limp neck, crazy cow syndrome. Those are names for diseases that have now been shown to be a long time ago shown to be um toxicities. Big head that's when the basically gets all lumpy and weird. That's from oxalate poisoning because oxalates strip out calcium from the blood. You have to demineralize your bones because if your calcium level in your blood goes too low, your heart stops. And so you have to sacrifice your bones for your heart obviously. And so when you sort of get away from that, all of a sudden it starts remmineralizing and regrowing. It starts getting this big lumpy big head sort of pattern to it. Right? So that's from expo chronic exposure to oxalates, right? >> So we know that all these things actually come from these herbivores eating plants that they're not designed for and getting sick from that. And then we even have nutritional deficiencies in animals that we know about too because that's very important. if they're not gaining weight, if they're getting sick because of some nutritional deficiency, like they need to know about it. So, they can put that in the feed, they can get that, you know, if it's not in the soil, they can get mineral licks and so on. This is why um you have things like selenium because selenium is a trace mineral. It's, you know, it's either in the soil or it's not. And so, if you're in sort of a deficient area, you you will have to put out uh selenium licks because cows can get uh musculardrophe uh from low selenium. And we call it nutritional musculardrophe. People can look that up. So that comes from a selenium deficiency in cows and they display musculardrophe. There's multiple kinds of muscular drophies in humans. This is very similar to to those. Um but that's a cause. So how many problems in humans are either from eating something that's toxic to us and harms us or like big head limp neck crazy cow syndrome or a nutritional deficiency like nutritional musculardrophe. We're not getting enough selenium. No one no one even knows about selenium. Never no one ever checks your selenium. I check people selenium. It's low unless they're on carnivore diet. Right? So you know how many of these diseases so-called diseases are actually nutritional deficiencies or toxicities from plant. And that's the argument that I'm making is that over time, you know, it's not that these things are just killing you on the spot, but over time they're building up harm just like the cyanogenic glycoides. And we know this. We know that X amount long-term will cause these issues, right? And when you're talking about nearly a billion people relying on cassava with cyanogenic glycoides as their main calorie source, that is a much bigger issue than people realize, right? um other things that can be toxic but also be anti-nutrients. So another way that plants have found themselves is by being less nutritious. So they can bind up their nutrients and yes there are good things in plants to get but you may not be able to access them because they're bound up in chemical bonds and we don't have the enzymes to break down which is proof positive that we are not biologically adapted to or supposed to eat those things. And that's why we have to expose them to different chemicals. We have to ferment them. we have to do these other things to break these chemical bonds and release these nutrients, make them more bioavailable. Um, another one is they can make other things less nutritious as well. Even if you're eating your your normal diet, they can have things like fitic acid, oxalates, as we mentioned, can bind to calcium, iron, magnesium, other sorts of things. Um, sapinins that can disrupt your body's enzymes that can break down these these nutrients as well. acid can bind irreversibly to various minerals and and nutrients. One argument that I heard wasn't a great argument from a vegan was that yes fitic acid can bind to these things and we don't have the enzymes for it but our gut microbiome does have the enzymes or the certain micro microbes can have these enzymes to break that down. Um, and so that's fine. But this is someone that that, you know, is is unfamiliar with the, you know, the digestive um idiosyncrasies of our gut because our microbiome is in our colon and and you may or may not have that um that bacteria. So you may not have the right bacteria to break that down, but whether you did or not, it doesn't matter because you don't absorb those nutrients in your colon. You absorb those in your small intestine. Now you're past that. So unless you went and ate your feces, >> which gorillas have to do, by the way, >> right? >> Then you're not getting those nutrients because you don't absorb it. So it doesn't matter what happens in your colon. What matters is before that. And we don't have the enzymes to break down that fitic acid complex with these nutrients. So um so you have these anti-nutrient effects. You have protease inhibitors, lipase inhibitors, these sorts of things that stop our and prevent our own enzymes from breaking down, fats and proteins, etc. Um, fiber can be an anti-nutrient all on its own because it can form a sort of a lattice. The the soluble fiber and insoluble fiber sort of form sort of like a you know sort of you know gummy sort of matrix that can actually be a physical obstruction to your enzymes getting to the food. So breaking down less of it and then that broken down food you blocks that from reaching the lumen of the intestine. So you you can eating fiber especially high fiber diet you can actually reduce your absorption of nutrients very all nutrients by up to 30%. And so this is this is why they say well eating a high fiber diet can be beneficial for diabetes because right well you're you're blocking out the absorption of 30% of the carbohydrates and your and your blood sugar goes down. It's not shocking. That's how that's how a number of the diabetes medications like acrobose or or even metformin to a certain extent actually that's how they work. Yeah. They block out they block out um metformin does more than that but it also blocks out some of the absorption I didn't know that >> B12 as well but also carbohydrates but acrib specifically blocks out a lot of the absorb not all of it but some of the absorption >> of um of carbohydrates and so that's why that's why people get that um but fiber does that as well. Um, so there are many other sorts of things. I mean, they make latex, we make latex gloves, and we use these sorts of things, you know, for but these saps are are they're not just there for fun. Um, latex is a really sticky, tacky um sort of sap that when an animal starts eating again, when they start chewing it, then it starts forming and leaking out and acts as like a glue and it can actually glue the mouth shut of the animals trying to eat it. And now they can't eat. They can't open their mouth and they die. and they starve to death over the coming weeks, which is a really nasty way to go. But that's just that's just a demonstration that plant is more than happy for you to die if it gets to live as all life on Earth is. You know, you get too close to a buffalo and Yellowstone park, it is going to take you out. Right. >> Right. It's not because it's trying to eat you. It's trying to make sure you're not trying to eat it and it feels threatened. And so, it will defend itself. But animals have kinetic defenses. They can run away. They can fight back. They can hide. Plants can't. They're just sitting there. They're stationary. And so they have to have these other defenses and that's that's something that people really need to take seriously. Hey guys, just want to take a second to thank our sponsor at Carnivore Bar. I don't promote many products because honestly all you need to be healthy is to just eat meat. But for those times that you're out hiking, road tripping, or stuck at work and you want nutritious snack that is just meat, fat, and salt if you want it, the carnivore bar is a great option. So I like this product not because it's just pure meat, but also because I want the carnivore market to thrive as well. And the more we support meat only products, the more meat only products there will be available in the mainstream. So if this sounds like something you'd like to get behind, check it out using my discount code Anthony to get 10% off, which also applies to subscriptions, giving you 25% off total. All right, thanks guys. All right, amazing answers to these questions. I don't know how you get all that out in such a short amount of time packed with information. I'm I'm I'm so amazed. Um I have this question I've been waiting to ask you. Now, we talked about some of the plant toxins. Some argue, all right, I'm sure you've heard this. The dose makes the poison. All right. How do you respond to people who say that plant toxins are harmless in small amounts that we eat? That oh, we can have a little bit. >> Yeah. All one million of them. >> Really? And so, that's the thing, you know, if if we're saying that the dose makes a poison. Yeah. Dose does make the poison. Okay. So, what's a dose? >> You don't get to just say that and then not, >> you know, come up with an answer, right? because the amount of cyanide that's that's a measurable amount that this will cause harm in a long-term period of time or this acutely toxic, right? And so people don't people have no idea what that that number is. And so flax seed is is far higher levels of of cyanogenic glycoides than sweet almonds do. Um and so you know even even six servings, seven servings can be a very serious um dose of s um cyanogenic glycoides >> uh to to an adult, right? And so we we're putting just tons of just scoops of flax seed into smoothies and things like that. There was actually a study that looked at smoothies, these different smoothie bars, and they actually found whole apples because there's lot there's cyanide and apple, right? Oh my god. >> Yeah. So they put whole They just put the whole thing in there. >> No, it's fine. instead of couring it out and taking the apple seed out >> because they're just blending it up. I don't care. And and they put flax seed in there and things like that. And they actually found um harmful levels of cyanide in a lot of these things. Certainly if if consumed uh regularly over time, it would absolutely be a dosage that would build up over, you know, over time. And if you had had a number of these things, oh, give me two extra flax flax seeds because they're so good for me sort of things, you can hurt yourself. you know, you're giving those to kids that are that are much more sensitive to this stuff, you you can really hurt them. And either way, even if it's not killing you, even if it's not causing an acute reaction, it's it's still not good for you. It's still causing low-grade harm. And so that's that's not good, you know, especially for a child. Um, yeah, dose does make the poison. The dose is really damn small. And if you are if you are saying that dose makes the poison, you have to then say what that dose is. Right. And so you can't just say dose makes a poison. Eat all the plants you want. Okay? Because each individual plant has thousands of these things. Right. >> Right. >> Okay. So maybe it's too low for one thing, but maybe it's high enough for another one. >> Okay. >> And and that's the other argument with with And how much are you eating? Because no one's telling you to limit it. They're actually saying the more plants you eat the better, >> right? >> Look at the blue zones. They just they're herbivores. They No, they're not. They're nearly carnivores actually, >> especially in like sardinia and things like that. But um you know, those have been shown to be fraudulent. Anyway, the the blue zone studies professor from Oxford actually showed that a lot of this stuff was pension fraud. People were actually lying about their age to qualify for pensions earlier. And so now they're like, "Oh, you're 110." Actually, they're they're 84 now, you know, but they signed up for this thing years ago. Yeah. >> And or their their um grandparents and grand uncles and things like that have actually since passed away 10 years ago, but they didn't tell anybody about it so they can keep collecting their pension check and their social security or something like that, right? Or their, you know, their government sort of uh pension check. So, you know, because a lot of these people were poor, there's in poor areas and they sort of needed this extra money to survive. Um so, in any case, it's um that that's been thoroughly um argued against. Uh but also they just eat way more meat than that. But so then people just say eat as much plants as you can. They're all good. Blah blah blah. You can't do that. You cannot do that without telling somebody what the dose is. They have no idea. So certain plants are going to have more or less of certain things, but let's say you're eating a lot of it. Let's say you're eating the same thing every single day. It's going to build up. Liam Hemsworth, the actor Chris Hemsworth, >> bring them up. Yeah. >> Yeah. Well, he he got sucked into this whole vegan nonsense from uh you know, a nutritionist that they had who who pushes that nonsense. Um and didn't tell him what the dose was. Oh yeah, it's all fine. Everything's great. Liam Hemsworth had to go to the hospital with acute oxalate poisoning from drinking spinach smoothies every morning for 3 weeks. You know, he could have died and he had to get emergency surgery to remove these massive kidney stones. So, you know, he got very sick. People have died from acute oxalate poisoning. And if you don't understand that that's a potential, you're you're really setting yourself up for a problem. Now, that doesn't necessarily mean you have to cut out all plants, but understand which ones are worse than others. Try to do things like cooking them, fermenting them, cooking them in in traditional ways like creamed spinach, spanopita, those sorts of things to lower the toxic load. And then mix them up. Don't eat the same thing every day so it doesn't give you give it a chance to build up in your system. Or if you want to feel the best that you that you that you possibly can and avoid that whole garbage in the first place and not have any toxins in your body, just don't eat them. You don't need them. You don't even want them. You know, it's just that, you know, from a health perspective. It's just that, you know, people are used to it and they they >> you know, they they want to keep doing that. Okay, fine. But, you know, just understand what they are. You know, the the next argument is is hormesis. So, yes, these things are toxic, but they're actually good toxins. This is good lead. You know, it's like, well, okay, again, you know, like the definition of a of a hormetic of something is hormetic is that it under under at past this point, it's toxic, right? Well, dose makes the poison. Okay. Past this point, it's poison. Here it's not poison or maybe even beneficial, hormetic. Okay. So, what is the dose? You have to answer that. And is this one chemical hormetic at this dose? Okay. So, okay. So, how much oxalates are hormetic? Right. First of all, cyanide is not hormetic. It is toxic all across the board. That's why there there's there's no safe level of of ingestion. And yet, this is in everything or in all sorts of things. And and we don't label this even though it's not considered safe to have any level of cyanide consumption really and especially for kids. Um, it's very small anyway. And um okay so let's say okay let's say let's pretend that oxalates are horatic which they're not um what would the dosage be right how many leaves would you be able to have before it became toxic what other things in spinach because there's thousands of other chemicals in there >> what other things in there are hormetic or not hormetic but toxic at a certain dose what are their doses you If you if you stay in the hormetic range with oxalates, are you toxic for another one? Right. >> Or if you get it, you know, you know what I mean? Or you get Yeah. Exactly. You don't know that. And that's the point is that it's just this people just saying, "Ah, it's tormetic. Ah, dose makes the poison." It's a throwaway line that means nothing. It's actually meaningless when you when you examine it because the only thing meaningful is to say what is the dose and what is the dose of all those chemicals in that plant >> and are they hormetic? Not all oxins are going to be hormetic but are they hormetic or not? >> What dosages are they hermetic and are they perfectly hormetically balanced? So that when you're at the if you eat five spinach leaves, are you getting a perfectly hormetic balance of oxalates and fitates and tannins and thises and that and the others or are they all over the shop, which they are, right? And and again, how many leaves can you eat? Five leaves, can you eat 10? Can you eat 100? >> Right? You start getting um really harmful levels of spinach at about 100 gram. So that's half a cup of cooked spinach. That's not much, right? So, you know, the thing is is that you have to know what doses of what. And again, there are thousands of these things. So, no one ever answers that, right? So, people don't know the answer. I don't think we know the answer. Yeah. >> No, of course they don't. Well, some things we do, like cyanide, right? None. None is the safe amount of cyanide to ingest. But there's certain amounts you get past. Okay. So, 40 to 50 almonds a day, that will build up harm over time and cause neurological dysfunction, thyroid dysfunction, multiorgan dysfunction, right? So that's a threshold and you need to know that right and then what else is in there that might be harmful. So, anytime someone says something's hormetic or dose makes a poison, say, "Okay, great. What's the dose, right? They can't answer that, don't listen to them." >> Absolutely. All right. For someone who's curious about removing plants from their diet, it's the reason we're here. >> What's the best way to start and what should they watch for in their first few weeks? >> Well, I mean, it it depends on where you're at mentally. I mean, if you if you're if you're like me and just sort of I'm I know this is toxic. I'm not going to eat anything toxic. No, thank you. And so I just threw everything out and just you just eat fatty meat until it stops tasting good. You do that as many times during the day that your body is telling you to do. You have to make sure you're eating enough. You have to eat until it stops tasting good. Literally, you get to a bite that tastes like cardboard. That's when you're done because your hunger signals are going to be very different. They're much more subtle and it's very easy to undereat on a carnivore diet. So it's important that you eat enough. >> Um and then it's just it's more about what you don't eat as well. So you need to get enough fat. So 1 to two grams of fat to one gram of protein. That's typically around the range that people need. You adjust for your own individual self. But then my hard rule for myself and and others is um that want to do this like I do it is no plants or mushrooms, no sugar or any sweeteners, nothing artificial. And that goes for sauces, seasonings, and drinks as well. So just meat, eggs, fish, chicken, salt, water. That's it. >> Mhm. >> Right. And you just eat until it stops tasting good. Um, if you are the type of person you're like, gh, yeah, dairy is a gray area. Probably try to avoid it at first, especially, you know, something like certainly anything with carbs, take it out. Um, and uh, even others can have quilomorphines can actually trigger a hunger response and and tell your body to store energy, fat. So, especially if you're trying to lose weight, dairies, dairy can be a problem. So, if you're going to have a bit of cheese every now and then, have it be a bit of cheese every now and then. have it as infrequently and as a condiment. So melting some cheese, have a cheesy omelette or slice of cheese on a burger patty or something like that. I wouldn't just eat blocks of cheese or anything like that. Um then the the other thing is that um if you're if you sort of can't get your head around just cutting out everything in a go and you want to do this in more peace meal fashion, you need to have a clear plan on on when you're going to do this. You just say, "Oh, I'll just sort of eat a bit more meat and sort of less of other things." Like that's good. you're moving in the right direction, but you're probably not going to sort of get to where you want to be. So, I would definitely cut out sugar, all junk food day one. Whole foods only. Focus on fatty meat. That's the main staple. Cut out carbs. Cut out sugar would be the next step. And then have a mark on the calendar on Friday, you know, carbs and sugar are gone, right? Next Friday, you know, oxilate high oxilate foods are gone. you know, next um night shades, potatoes, tomatoes, eggplants, peppers, those sorts of things. Very high in lectins. Want to get those things out and just start cutting these things out. Beads, seams, legumes, nuts, those are very high in lectins. You cut those those suckers out. Um and you just go down the go down the track however you want to you want to do that. And then on this day, hopefully four weeks later, nothing else except me, egg, salt, and water. That's it. And so if you have that clear timeline of on this day, I'm cutting this out. on this day, I'm cutting the next stuff out. And the whole time you're focusing on eating the meat and eating less and less of the plants, I think you'll do well. But, uh, so it depends on your personality type and what you can get your head around. But if you're going to just jump into it, jump into it. But make sure you're eating enough. Make sure you're eating the right things. And if you're going to go into it slowly, have a clear and distinct plan on when you're going to get to full carnivore. >> Excellent advice. Thank you. All right. I want to be really uh considerate of your time. Will you participate in a 10 question lightning round real quick? >> Sure. >> All right. Quick fire with Dr. Chaffy. Real quick answers. Number one, what plant food would you never touch again? >> No. Any any, you know, grain, seeds, legumes, nuts, anything with carbohydrates as well, but those high oxilate containing things and and the night shades as well. >> All right. Most toxic plant compound in your opinion? I mean, of the edible plants, you know, I mean, that would be thing. Probably the lectins. The lectins are pretty awful. A lot of those can be denatured with with cooking, but they're I mean, cyanide is is obviously just it'll just kill you, you know, but um uh so cyanide would be the worst definitely. But then lectins would be would be close to that as well. And those are in the edible ones. Obviously, the non-edible ones, they all just kill you. So, they're all pretty bad. >> All right, number three. The healthiest food people eat that's actually hurting them. Oh, what they think is healthy. >> That's actually >> Yeah. I mean, I'm basically the whole whole sort of gambit of of gamut of of vegetarian sort of diet approaches. Um um you know, like oat milk and all these other sorts of things. These are highly processed garbage, you know, I mean, and and the highly processed plant-based uh meats and things like that. I mean, these these have been shown that they're just filled with chemicals that you don't want. there all these plant toxins on top of the chemicals you're adding towards that. >> Um those are pretty harmful and people think that they're that they're healthy because they're plant-based, but it's it's definitely nothing could be further from the truth. >> Right. One plant toxin that's the most underestimated would it be the lectins? >> Lectins definitely because people don't just don't realize how many problems that they cause. I mean, as far as causing widespread harm, I think lectins are are are well up there. Um, even with the this the amount of people that eat, you know, cassava, you know, that's going to be significant health impact. But the lectins, no one knows that the I mean the beans, the seeds, know those are probably the healthiest things that people think they're, oh, they're so healthy. They're horrible for you. Horrible. I mean, the WHO even says that as little as five red kidney beans have put people in the hospital when undercooked or uncooked. >> Um, so, you know, it's it's they're they're really harmful. Um, and they and even when they're they've been denatured to a point and they're not as toxic as acutely toxic as that, they they can still cause harm and they again autoimmunity autoimmune diseases are are on the rise significantly. They're massive increase in in autoimmunity um especially in recent years and decades. And that's because we're going more plant-based and we're saying, "Oh, this is so good. Raw plants, all that stuff." It's getting worse. And I mean stem, you know, 60 70% of the people that follow me on social media and YouTube were former vegans, vegetarians, plant-based. And so many of them, yes, they improved their their their health at first when they um got rid of all the junk food and crap and they felt that, oh yeah, it's getting rid of meat and I feel so much better. Well, no, actually they they changed their life dramatically. They stopped drinking, smoking, they started working out, started eating whole foods, they stopped eating junk food, all these sorts of things. Massive changes uh that they made. no soda anymore, all that sort of stuff. They made a lot of really positive health changes and and one really bad decision that hurt their health, which is getting rid of the meat. And now they're eating a lot of plant toxins and they're not eating the meat. And this build up over time, they start getting autoimmunity. That's such a common thing I see in plant-based former plant-based eaters is serious autoimmune issues as well. >> All right, same probably same answer, but worst plant for your gut. >> Oh, definitely the lectins. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, those suckers are yeah, really bad for your gut. They cause leaky gut which is associated with over 100 different autoimmune issues and and all sorts of problems. And you know the other thing too is you know the Trojan horse that gets in here are the aggrochemical um you know compounds like the glyphosates and things like that that are on the plants and get in your body and cause absolute hell in your body and your gut. Uh glyphosate can damage your gut and kills your microbiome. It's an antibiotic. It kills the soil biome. It kills your microbiome and it can damage your gut and cause leaky gut as well. Get in your body and and is strongly associated with autoimmunity. Whether it's binding to, you know, your organs and damaging them, your body's making an immune response towards that as well like it does with lectins or like it likely does with lectins. Don't know. But, uh, either way, there's a strong association there. >> All right. You uh have no meat, fish, eggs, anything available. If you had to eat one plant for survival, what would it be and why? Um, well, I mean, am I on my own or is there someone >> You're on a deserted island. There's no >> chop off their leg or something like that. >> Um, no. Um, well, obviously depend on what's there, but you know, um, certain fruits are less toxic. >> Okay. >> Many fruit will fruit will still kill you. If you go out in the woods and you just see random fruit, a random berry, it is not safe to eat those things. They can kill you. Um, so most of these things have evolved with other animals that are not you um to um to propagate their seed and things like that, but they can be very toxic uh to other animals that eat them. So those sorts of those sorts of fruit, especially someone ones that have a bit of sweetness to it, those typically have a lower toxic load to for us, but things like grapes will still kill cats and dogs for instance because of the tannins and things like that in there. So those sorts of things. But anything that I would eat, I would always do it in the traditional ways that we that our ancestors have eaten these things. Fermenting them, cooking them, peeling them, taking the skin off, taking the seeds out, boiling the hell out of the pulp like we used to do with tomatoes. That's what traditional tomato sauce. Um make sure they're vine ripe and those sorts of things if it if it is a fruit. Um those sorts of things. So anything that I would eat, it would be in that traditional way. There's there's a great book by a friend of mine, Dr. Bill Schindler. He's a paleonthologist and archaeologist and he wrote a book called Eat Like a Human. And it talked about, okay, first of all, we're all eating meat. But in the last 10,000 years, we started eating more plant foods because we had to because the megapona died out um either because we hunted them out or was as I think there was some sort of mass extinction event like a like a sort of a asteroid or something like that because all the megapona died on every continent at the same time. So that's probably not everyone just hunting them out of extinction at the same time. Probably not. We're probably well on our way, but you know, it happened too quickly in my opinion. So, um, either way, we ran out of those things and, uh, so people had to start turning to more plant foods in certain areas, right? And so, um, he goes through in this book all the different sorts of ways that people started doing that to ferment and change and cook and this and that to to lower the toxic load of these specific plants and increase the bioavailability, make them more nutritious because that's another thing too. You just you can't just eat something and call it good. You know, we're not like a you know, we're not just like a combustion engine. Anything that burns is okay, right? It's um, you know, like a steam locomotive. It's we need specific nutrients, you know? So um that so whatever I would eat it would be in that traditional way of of trying to as much as I could fermenting these things etc. Um that's what I would eat and I would yeah work very hard to you know make a fishing pole after that. >> Yeah. Exactly. All right. Great answer. One last question in that same category. All right. Your go-to cut of meat if you could only eat one forever. What is your favorite? >> I I mostly eat ribeye already right now. your birthday every day, right? I remember you saying >> that's it. That's it. Yeah. Well, that was my birth. Yeah. On my birthdays, I always got, you know, the meal that you want, you know, all I wanted was some big steak and I wanted as much steak as I could eat because normally we have, you know, seven people in my family and five kids and my parents. >> Um, meat was we all wanted the meat and so you just had to have your fair share and then you had to fill up with the rest of the stuff. But I just want, okay, on my birthday, I just want to eat as much meat as I want to until I'm done. And so that's what I did. And it was always steaks. And now I just do that every day. >> And so it just feels like my birthday every day. >> And how do you like your meat? Do you like it rare, raw in the middle, like black and blue, or do you like it medium rare? How does >> Pretty much. Yeah, I I often often go for, you know, more blue these days. So I like it more rare, but seared on the outside, nice and crunchy and crispy on the outside. I age my steaks as well so they they they brown really well so you get this nice crispy bubbly crust and then the inside can be fair. >> How long do you age it in you put in the refrigerator? Put it with salt. I know you don't do salt that much anymore but do you how long you take in the refrigerator? >> So you know I don't do like a whole loin. I won't age. So I'll wet age the loin like in the the vacuum sealed pack but then when I open it up I cut it up into stakes put it on dry it increases the the surface area so it dries out faster. That's sort of the main thing that you're trying. You're trying to dry it. You know, you're actually not in this case, I'm not trying to cultivate bacteria or fungus that will help, you know, break down that the meat um that have to be cut away and thrown away and things like that. What I want to do is I want to dry it out. And so that helps concentrate the flavor and helps it brown a lot better. >> How long do you dry a regular say ribeye steak? 20 12 hours? >> No, at least overnight. So you at least want to do it overnight in the fridge. Um, and if you salt it, that's when you salt it because the salt can actually soak through it and it it sort of is quite nice to salt it all the way through evenly. >> U, but at least overnight. I mean, just doing that overnight, I mean, it completely changes the flavor that, you know, doing that with chicken or fish just overnight really improves the flavor as well. >> Um, but you have to have it on a drying rack, like a metal rack, not touching anything else. It has to have air circulating around all sides because otherwise it'll it'll build, you know, trap moisture and that's where bacteria can can hide. So, if it's drying, it won't grow mold. Cannot, right? Because mold can't grow without without water. So, as long as it's not touching anything, you'll be fine. It'll just turn into, you know, beef jerky at the end of it. So, that's good, too. You know, that's not a big deal. So, when I do I cut up really big thick steaks, so I just want one of these big things per day. I don't want to have to cook up five steaks. There's one 3-inch thick steak. >> Cool. >> Those sort of like threeinch thick steaks. I found that the the really ideal point for both flavor and texture, so it doesn't dry out too much, but it gets really good flavor, is about 5 to seven days. And I've sort of, as I've been doing this more and more, I sort of didn't like it any older than that. I mean, even like a week, two weeks old. I had one that was in there for like 3, four weeks, it just it looked like a just a just a jerk. >> Black. Yeah. >> But I cooked it up and it was still it was still um red in the middle, you know. So, it just it just sort of had the the moisture level of like a AI tuna, like um like a like a like a seared AI >> and it was amazing. The flavor was incredible and so and the outside was just it was just all crunchy. It was like it was like this crust. So, I actually really like that, you know, but that gets a bit a bit much. You know, some of it's a bit dry and it's you know, it's not as good, but the flavor was amazing. Um but I'd say five to seven days is is has been my sweet spot. >> All right. And do you do eggs? Yeah, sometimes I I just find that I need I need like, you know, 15 of these damn things. So, I just like cracking eggs and just it takes forever. I just it's easier just to throw on a steak. But yeah, no, eggs are great. >> All right, great. >> I consider them honorary meat. You know, it's all the it's all the nutrients that you need to turn into an animal and so it's it's great. >> Mostly me. This has been fant I could talk for three hours with you. I could talk 10 hours with you. You're just amazed. You pack so much information in such a small amount and I listen to you every day and I want to thank you for taking the time to meet with me. My audience, I want them to come over. I want them to see your channel. I want to find Dr. Anthony Chaffy and listen to all your amazing interviews. Where can they find you? >> Oh, well, thank you very much for having me. It's been a pleasure. My main channel is my YouTube channel. It's just Anthony Chaffy MD. And so that's Chaffy spelled C H A Fe. And uh so that's where most of my videos are. I also have a podcast called The Plant-Free MD. You can get the audio tracks for all of these. It's it's a bit easier to navigate on the podcast because it does have all the other because I I'll make like shorts and and clips that are sort of 10 15 minutes long, 20 minutes long. Sort of getting certain points out um that might be out of a 2 hour, three hour interview. Maybe not all of them are that long, but you know, some of them people like I just I don't have that much time, you know. So, I have the shorter ones too. Um, and I have playlists on there, people looking for specific things on the YouTube channel. So, like getting started on a carnivore diet or autoimmunity or athletics. Um, those sort of cancer, those sorts of things. So, I've sort of curated a couple of those lists people want to check a look at. And, um, and then I have, um, Instagram just Anthony Chaffy MD. I have Twitter, Anthony Chaffy. There's some other ones, too, but those are the main ones. >> All right. I want, if you could stay on after I end the recording, I want to give you a proper goodbye. Thank you so much for this interview. And uh maybe I get to do you again. That would be wonderful. >> Yeah, definitely. I I was going to say too, I just forgot. I just started up a website. I have a lot of resources. I even have a lot of studies and literature you can sort of look up like this thing. It'll pop up videos, but also pop up studies and things like that that people can look at. So, it's just dranthonychafi.com and you can that'll link to all my social media, too. >> Excellent. Perfect. Right. >> Okay. All right. Thank you. Hey, guys. Thank you very much for taking the time out to listen to what I had to say. If you like it, then please like and subscribe to my YouTube channel and podcast. And if you're on YouTube, then please hit that little bell and subscribe. And that'll let you know anytime I have a new video out, which should be every week, if not more. And if you could share this with your friends, that would help me get the word out and let me know that you like what I'm doing. Thanks again, guys.