The Medical System Failed Him — Andrew Rollins’ Fight for His Life

[Music] Hello everyone. Thank you for joining me for another episode of The Plant-Free MD. I'm your host, Dr. Anthony Chaffy, and today I have a very special guest, Mr. Andrew Rollins, who is going to tell us his uh his story. Andrew, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you so much for having me. It's an honor, really. Oh, well, thank you. Uh well, I appreciate you taking the time and and obviously coming on telling your story. It's I think it's really important and helpful for people uh who may be suffering from something similar or know someone who does and and know that um you know there's hope. So thank you very much for that. Yeah. Yeah. There's there's definitely hope especially on the car diet. Good. Well, so for people who haven't come across you or your story, can you tell us a bit about you and and uh a bit about your story? Sure. Yeah. My name is Andrew. I live in Utah right now and I'm 23 years old. I've had health issues for a lot of my life, but um they started getting pretty serious when I was about 15 or 16. Um I ate fairly healthy and I always knew that um it could be a little bit better, but I didn't know just as much how food um affects your health. And when I started to change my diet, my health started to change around. Good. So, what were some of the the health issues that you had, if you're comfortable talking about them? Yeah. So, when I was a kid, I was sick a lot with different things. Like, I would just get sick and it just wouldn't go away. They'd put me on antibiotics and um my gut biome just never really recovered, I think. So further into life, um I just started to get really bad gut issues. That was where it started. And then respiratory problems followed. Um basically just inflammation of multiple systems, respiratory and digestive and then it started to affect other things like fatigue and um I started to have insomnia. My throat would just close up and there was lots of irritation. irritation in the bronchioles and the throat and it worked its way into my sinuses. So, just breathing mainly was my main concern for the longest time. It felt like I was suffocating every second of every day like I'm drowning at the bottom of a pool, like I'm breathing through like a coffee mixer, like those tiny little straws. And it's quite debilitating. Jesus. Did Did they ever get a diagnosis on what exactly was going on? Yeah. So, they called it bronchitis originally and they prescribed more antibiotics which made it much worse actually. And at the time, even at the time, I didn't believe in antibiotics because my gut biome was already so messed up. But I trusted the experts and um so did my mother which I was only 15 at the time. So I was willing to go through the rounds take the standard course of trying to treat it. So yeah it was bronchitis and then it was GD um and then esophagitis and sinusitis just lots of inflammation going on. Yeah. And then and then none of the treatments work though. Is that right? Yeah, none of them worked. And also I was very skeptical as well. And so some of the things I maybe didn't give a full um a full chance, but I didn't see that it would cure me. I kept asking the doctors like, "Okay, this inhaler might help a little bit with the swelling, but is it ever going to fix the problem?" And every time I asked that question, they would say no with every treatment I was ever offered. But I knew that there was something more um out there for me that actually could reverse my condition. I didn't want to just put a band-aid on it. And in fact, a lot of these treatments come with their own side effects and just makes it worse in the long run, I think. Yeah. Yeah. Well, certainly some of them can and and that's the problem is some some things are just symptomatic. I mean, you know, if you have a have a really bad infection and your body's not clearing it and you know, antibiotics could actually fix the the root problem, right? But, uh, there's the vast majority of medications that we put people on are like you say, it's just a band-aid just to cover something up of a problem that you're dealing with as opposed to fixing the problem. Like you have your thyroid removed, giving someone thyroid hormone, like that is that is the fix. the underlying issues that you don't have a functioning thyroid. So you've replaced that its uh function partially anyway. And so um you know that's you know that that's that's great. You know that's sort of there's some underlying you know root cause sort of medicine there but good good proportion of it 90% or so say um is is just symptom management. And unfortunately, uh, those are the tools that that we have that we get taught as doctors is just symptom management because that's what the drug companies are putting out now. And and the investment companies like Goldman Sachs, you know, get mad at them when they actually cure something like Gilead. They they actually had a cure for heepsi and then Goldman Sachs sent them a memo saying that you messed up. You never cure anything. You want to you want to treat things, treat the symptoms. Now you have all these people that will never require treatment for the rest of their life. You've lost 50 years of revenue on however many, you know, millions of people, you know, and um, you know, which is just a sick twisted mentality really. And um, yeah, so unfortunately doctors don't realize that. We just get taught what we get taught like these are the treatments. And the only reason I'm being taught this in medical school or taught this in residency is because this is the gold standard. this is the best we figured out because we think that people are actually trying to find cures and find the best ways to help people because that is what used to happen and it's been corrupted over the last you know 70 80 years but it's um yeah it's unfortunately those are the tools we have is uh is a symptom control and and unfortunately and then also they don't know exactly what's going on then how do you how do you know exactly how to treat it or cure it if you don't even know sort of what's happening unfortunately. Yeah. Yeah, that's exactly right. And I think just like many other industries, innovations are suppressed because it's it's much more profitable to slowly release new innovations than it is to do a quantum leap to something that's much more effective. Um, progress is often hampered by the people that want to continue on their financial trajectory. Um, so the medical industry is a business as much as it is um trying to help people. I think if we were trying to help people, uh, we'd be curing a lot more people of their diseases. Mhm. Yeah. And or at least looking for them, you know. Um, you know, doctors on the ground. I mean, I'm legitimately trying to help and and cure people, but just working with the tools that that we're provided and and um don't really think about it much past that like, well, this is the best treatment we have and unfortunately it's only symptomatic. But um when you understand that that these are designed to be symptomatic control and are not looking at root cause, then you have to sort of say, okay, well, that's their business model and that's fine. So, I I'm not going to look for them for cures. I'm going to have to try and figure this out or or you know try to see who is actually looking for a cure. You know, you mentioned that they sort of slowly release certain things. It's the same in most industries in the car industry. I know that um you know some company will release a car and it's got you know 300 horsepower and you know 30 m to the gallon and this and that and the other and um and then the next year it's like 305 horsepower and 32 m to the gallon and like the next year it's just a bit up and a bit up and a bit up and I spoke to someone in the in the automotive industry and they said yeah you know that that fifth iteration that's actually what the R&D team came up with first and but it was so much better than everything else that they actually like put um put inhibitors on it and governors on it to make it worse. And so a lot of mechanics know that that all you do is they already have these governors and these inhibitors on it. All you have to do is like to get more horsepower and better gas mileage and and better performance out of your cars, just you take off those governors and you take off those inhibitors and all of a sudden you just got, you know, 20 more horsepower, things like that. and uh and then and then they they put in one chunk of R&D and then they have five years of um of products that they can put out. You know, back in 2000, early 2000s, there was a there's a company um called Appera, AP Ter, it's it's still around. It's like a terra 2. But back then um there was it was an aeronautical engineer and he sort of looked at this and he said um you know this is right when the hybrids were coming out gas prices started going crazy and um and you know like the best ones out there could get like 40 miles to the gallon and people were like wow that's amazing and there was one car that was really expensive you know like over $100,000 at the time so that was super expensive and um and that got like 100 miles to the gallon or a little over 100 miles to the gallon, but it was really really expensive. It was, you know, not many people are going to be able to afford it. And so he said, um, you know, that that's not right. That we have the technology right now today back in early 2000s to make a car that gets that gets 300 miles to the gallon and costs less than $30,000. And so he had the Sapura. So he made this thing and it and it apparently did that. Um he had it had three wheels, two in the front, one in the back because it had to be like a personal you know motor vehicle something like that like a like a motorcycle because um when you have a new body design it's it takes six years of crash tests to get that approved uh by the US government and um and so uh but motorcycles only it was only one year and so he had to do that or else because he said all these these big automotive companies were just going to try to squash him, right? You because again it's that that quantum leap and now they've all got to actually like compete with that now, but they don't they don't want to. They want to they want to slowly sort of build up and um and uh and so he yeah, he said if he didn't get out in a year, he he wouldn't be able to do it. And I and I don't I think he they were starting to make some, but then it just sort of they they weren't able to take off. But like it's still around and they have like like more vehicles like that. I don't know why they're not advertising because, you know, if it's if it's uh the case that they actually did this, they have a much better product than anybody else. And then like um Intel like the the computers and things like that. There's the Intel processor was way better than any other processor. And the Intel 2 came out was like twice as good. Intel 3 came out was like next level again. First one they discover they made was actually Intel 3. That was actually the Intel 1, but they just like knocked it back and made it worse. So that because it was so much better, they're like, "No, no, no. We we can stretch this out for years." So yeah, unfortunately. And when you're doing that with with health care, you know, these are people's lives and their health and their happiness and their and their ability to function and um it's just it's just absolutely wild to me that that um health is is commoditized like that. And it's just, you know, it's just it's just another way to milk money out of people and uh just turn them into, you know, indentured servants and um and surfs, you know, where you're just, you know, these these land barons are just sucking money out of out of the populace. It's absolutely sick to me. Absolutely. It is. It's sickening. Um it's selfish. I like to think about humanity as a whole like that's my family. And so like if it's better for everyone, it's better for me. Um, but I think if you only think about yourself, then it's like why do I need to make the planet a better place? I just need me and my family to have a better situation. So, and it really makes you wonder like things like I'm sure you've heard of like the engine in a car that supposedly ran on water. It really makes you wonder if things like this might be possible. And then when they come out with certain scientists if and then they might go they just disappear mysteriously. Like it really makes you wonder if even in the medical industry like there's cures for a lot of these things and and they're just they just vanish off the face of the earth. Um because yeah, it's it's easier to just stay on the trajectory that you're on. Like you have these projections and if something comes out that could destroy the entire industry. Like why are we still using oil when there might be energy innovations out there that could destroy the one of the biggest industries in the entire world? The people with that type of power are probably investing heavily into suppressing things that will topple that industry. So, I think that humanity has always kind of taken the selfish route of we're not doing what's best for the the good of all people. We're just doing what we can to stay the same and and progress slowly. Um, so as far as curing people, I believe that there's many different ways to cure many different things, but I don't think you'll find them um in traditional medicine, at least not in the USA, for for certain things. Um, as far as I've learned, diet has helped me a lot with what I'm doing. I'm sure that there's certain things that diet can't fix completely. Um, but as far as like actually reversing a condition instead of just treating the symptoms, I think diet is the most important thing by far. Hey guys, just want to take a second to thank our sponsor, Carnivore Bar. I don't promote many products because honestly, all you need to be healthy is to just eat meat. But for those times that you're out hiking, road tripping, or stuck at work and you want nutritious snack that is just meat, fat, and salt if you want it, the Carnival Bar is a great option. So, I like this product not because it's just pure meat, but also because I want the carnivore market to thrive as well. And the more we support meat only products, the more meatonly products there will be available in the mainstream. So, if this sounds like something you'd like to get behind, check it out using my discount code Anthony to get 10% off, which also applies to subscriptions, giving you 25% off total. All right, thanks guys. for a lot of things. Yeah. I mean, I mean, going back to Hypocrates, you know, thy food be thy medicine and medicine thy food, you know, and and before you try to cure someone, first ask them if they're willing to give up that which is making them sick. You know, we're we're supposed to be healthy. Our bodies should work properly. They shouldn't just be breaking down. If they are, then it's likely there's an external exposure that's causing that. And there can be genetic factors, but typically you need a genetic predisposition and an environmental trigger. Um very few things have 100% penetrance where if you have that gene you will get that condition. There are very few things that that fit that criteria. Um most other things are a mix. You I mean there's things are purely environmental like you get your arm cut off or something like that. I mean there's nothing in your genes that are going to you know predispose you to that unless you're just like an and it's just like all right well this guy's this guy's probably likely to get get his ass kicked sometime. Almost everything that we deal with from a health perspective is a combination of that. These diseases that we talk about or combination of genetic predisposition and environmental trigger or it's just purely environmental and we don't even realize it and so or but you can be more susceptible or less susceptible to certain environmental triggers as well. So I think there is a there's still a combination there and um and so if we yeah I I think that root cause medicine is um is obviously the way we have to go and understanding just how pertinent diet is to that um is so important. But it it does threaten massive inter industries, multi-t trillion dollar industries because it threatens the processed food plant-based industry that's giving you a bunch of junk food and packaged food that has a huge markup. They make a lot of money on there's a very very small margin on um meat like whole meat products. When you process and put a bunch of crap on it, you know, then it's then you have a bigger markup. and um but just actual just meat like just steak and roast and ground beef or chicken or whatever. There's very small markup on that. And so, you know, you're threatening that industry, but then you're also threatening the multi multi-trillion dollar pharmaceutical industry and healthcare industry where if people just aren't sick all the time, then we don't have to spend all this money. came in at Harvard University School of Public Health, you know, had a recent publication last, you know, 10 years or so that um they looked at just five chronic diseases. So, um what was it? COPD, cancer, uh cardiovascular disease, uh diabetes in totality and mental health issues. So, not autoimmunity, not dementia, Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, all these other sorts of things like just those five that worldwide that accounted for um estimated at 2030 was going to be around $15 trillion a year in direct and indirect costs. And then lost opportunity cost. So, people out of work, they're not able to function, they're taking sick days, they're on disability, stuff like that. um that cost between 2010 and 2030 uh something like $42 trillion out of the economy and then the biggest one was the um the lost life. You know, if someone has a heart attack at, you know, 35, 45, people in India, vegetarians are having heart attacks in their 20s and teens. Now, I have a a guy I interviewed, uh, Anchor Verma, he's a ER, um, doctor there. Um, he he's getting these kids in their 20s having heart attacks and strokes and they're vegetarians, vegans, and things like that. And it's like, you can't blame that on the meat. They eat 3 kilos of meat per person per year. And uh, and they're the sickest population on earth. They say that America is absolutely not. I mean we are very sick but most other western countries are exactly as sick as we are and other places like India are far more sick than we are and um and so you know he's you know seeing yeah all these heart attacks and strokes and things like that something like one in four people in India will die of a heart attack and one in three men will die of a heart attack. You know absolutely insane. And so the lost life, the cost of that lost life, someone dying in their prime and not being able to work for the next 40 years that that's costing in 2010 it cost the planet economically about I think it was $23 trillion a year. And then in 2030 it's estimated to be all the way up to like $43 trillion a year of just lost lives. These people are just dead. They're not in the economy anymore. they're not going to be able to to produce and help and contribute. That's just for those five. Just those five, right? You know, not all the other things as well. So, it's huge business. It's huge business. Um, you know, the lost opportunity and the lost lives. Obviously, no one's making money on that, but that that $14 trillion just in the direct and indirect costs, that's what is driving that entire thing. So, you know, we're spending, you know, call it $60 trillion a year, um, or losing that from the economy so that, you know, this, you know, specific industry can make $14 trillion a year and the processed food, junk food, garbage, um, you know, tobacco industry, alcohol, all that sort of stuff can make however many trillions that they make. It's a it's a losing proposition. You know, we're getting we're just destroying the, you know, the planet. are destroying the health of health of the world and economically were just devastating us. I mean, no no system on earth is is going to survive that for for very long when you lose all that human capital and you get more and more people dependent and sick, you know, like, you know, to get back to your story, you know, there was a there was a period there that it sounds like you were very sick, probably unlikely that you would be able to to function normally, to work normally, to contribute normally. And um as a result you would be dependent on others and some in a lot of areas that's going to be dependent on the state that uh now you're going to have to you know take dis you know people are going to be on disability people are going to be on on welfare and things like that and that's going to put a a larger and larger burden on on the state to take care of people. And then when you get a surplus of people that are on disability and can't function, can't work properly, then there's not going to be enough other people to support that model. things are going to crash and um uh so it's it's not it's not a you know it yeah anyway there's farreaching um sort of ramifications of this but I was going to say so you know it sounds horrible I'm really sorry that you had uh to deal with that um what what changed for you how did you figure this out that that you could change this with diet and what what brought you to trying diet in the first place and then you know what happened as a old. Yeah. Um so basically following the traditional path just led me down a ton of different um I was check with this specialist and this medication and they kept sending me to different people. It was almost like this person couldn't figure it out and then they would just brush me off to someone else. And I realized really quickly like not only do they not care about me as a person cuz it's just their job. They don't really have enough time during the meeting to figure it out completely and then you have to just keep going back. But that's like months at a time of suffering not getting down to the bottom of it. So even getting into it, I knew that this was probably going to be the case for me. And I kept telling my mom the whole time like they're not going to help me. They don't care. they don't know how to help me and like it's not something like a broken arm where they could help me. Like for me it was always a mystery illness with with vague um diagnosis and the medications were like they tried to give me anxiety medication for my respiratory problems and is because well it's because they can be related for sure. So, I see that one. But they wanted to keep giving me things that weren't necessary. And I would always go into these meetings like with expectations that we could figure something out together. But I'd be sitting there waiting for them to ask me the crucial lifestyle questions that they never would. How much sunlight do you get? How much exercise do you get? What is your diet like? What is your mental health like? What is your daily habits like? Never even a single time. How much water do you drink? Never even a single time. And so it was really frustrating for me. But um yeah, so even going into it, I had no faith at all that they were going to be able to help me because if you truly knew how to cure somebody, you'd be asking those questions. And I was never asked that even a single time. So during this whole process, um I was trying different things and I was looking into different things on my own. Um, it was an obligation for me that I had to cure myself because nobody else had the answers for me. And I'm sure that that could be different for other people with different things. Um, it's not all bad. And some of the doctors, it seemed like they did care, but they really don't have the time to invest um, personally into me. I think it takes it takes a real healer that's dedicated to you personally as an individual to like walk through your life with you and figure out what is causing this problem in the first place and get rid of it and then try to heal the disease that's the consequence of that. Um, so I was looking into biology so that I could figure out what is actually happening inside of my body and I was looking into supplementing plants and I thought I had deficiencies. I mean, of course, I had deficiencies. I was looking into what different types of things were attacking my system because in my opinion, that's usually the case. um whether it be a pathogen, a virus, a parasite, a a fungus, um I knew something was eating away at my mucosal membrane, the protective layer that's protecting the soft tissue of all these systems. And um I knew that it was gone and I knew that definitely the antibiotics didn't help. So, I was taking pre and probiotics, changing my diet, supplementing, getting more exercise, doing meditation practice. Um, just really just hitting just firing at all cylinders as much as I could and and really I didn't see much progress. Um, but along the journey, I learned much more about what it means to heal and and what was actually happening within me. um actually about the same age that I got this disease. My little brother got the disease when he turned 15 as well. So I was 19 at the time, a couple years deep and then he got it too. So that was a huge like I was already um super hopeless and it saved my life the fact that now I had my best friend, my little brother to to take care of and to help I wanted to figure it out even more and and he was there to help me figure it out. So it was honestly a blessing although it was very painful to watch him uh get the same thing as me. to go a little bit into detail about like what I lived with um and still some to this day. It was debilitating. I couldn't work and I had to drop out of school. I really never left the house. Um, I laid in bed most of the day suffocating and um, it felt like you were someone was pouring battery acid down my throat because the acid reflux would come up and eat away at my throat and come up into my sinuses and especially when I was sleeping because I couldn't do anything about it really. Um, although I tried their their proton inhibitors which honestly made it worse. Um, it felt like my stomach was eating itself alive, like it was collapsing and um, and just suffocation all the time. But you don't want to just give up on life and just lay in bed all day. So when I would go out, I'd have to pretend like I was fine just in just in order to like exist as a like a normal human being. I would just try to u make up for how I was feeling by pretending and putting on a show like I was like I was normal, but I'm suffering all the time. Um so it affects your relationships, it affects your work life, it affects your mental health. And so anybody out there that's suffering with chronic health issues, especially mystery ones, I can sympathize with you. And I promise you there is hope. And I promise you that there's a lot more people out there that know what you're go know what it's like to go through the same thing. Although that might not make you feel better. Uh I can relate and and so meeting those types of people reading about online helps. And my little brother getting the same condition as me helped a lot because now I could talk about it with somebody that actually understood and and we figured it out together. We tried different diets. I think it started with just elimination diets. Um definitely just all the processed garbage and um I went to vegan alkaline vegan at some point. I don't know if you've heard of Dr. Sei. Definitely worth looking into. I think he was curing a lot of people with a um an alkaline diet that he said would create sustain environment in which things couldn't exist in with a high alkalinity like very limiting diet of fruits and vegetables. But it's honestly just trying to mimic what the carnivore diet does much better. And I'm sure there's many deficiencies that come with a diet like that. But we tried that. we tried a the medical medium diet. Um, and then eventually I had just given up completely and I just started giving back into my addictions because food is the biggest addiction. I don't know if a lot of people like look at it that way, but um like addiction is what causes diseases. It's like you're cashing in on the health that you have um for pleasure and eventually it'll catch up to you. But if you sacrifice pleasure for health, eventually you can get back to ground zero hopefully. And then we found carnivore diet at the end of the changing our diet all the time. Yeah. And and what sort of what sort of changes did you see when you went carnivore or or with these other diets? I mean, did I'm I'm sure that you know, just cutting out processed foods and things like that would have had some benefit. Did you see help along the way? Obviously, it didn't help enough or you wouldn't have kept looking for for new answers, but um what were some of the changes that you saw with these different diets? Yeah, so uh for instance, the Dr. SE diet like hugely restrictive and so because of that obviously I wasn't getting as many toxins from the garbage that I would normally be eating on a regular diet and so I would have less of everything basically like a lot of my symptoms started to go away but it didn't feel like the condition was actually reversing. Um, but definitely having less toxins and less um what like starches and grains. They're so hard to digest, some of them impossible to break down within the body. So, I had less digestive problems. I tried intermittent fasting and I noticed my energy was much better when I wasn't eating all the time. I realized that um if I was getting the things I needed, then everything after that was just part of the addiction. And so I started to find that balance with changing my diet all the time and then finally getting on carnivore. Um initially very difficult as you might imagine um for a regular human being eating just regular stuff. It was like first withdrawal, like strongest withdrawal I had ever experienced. Um I couldn't focus because my body wanted sugar and that persisted for probably a week or so. But um I could tell that I was detoxing and anybody that's ever done a fast, it feels like fasting when you first eliminate everything. I went straight on to the lion diet like Miss Michaela Peterson. And so it it was like a huge jump from what I was eating at the time. And so yeah, withdrawal and then lack of energy. Um feeling all the toxins as they leave my body and then finally keto flu. Um and that's that's the worst of it. And then after that it was like everything started to change. All my inflammation started to wayne. Uh my energy level was not only consistent but much higher than it had ever been. My quality of sleep started to get much higher. All my digestive issues started to go away. Um I felt more light within my body. I felt like I was sharper without all the toxins in my brain. And there was more energy going towards things like getting ahead, like building more white blood cells, like all the things that happen when you're deep into a fast. I could feel them cuz I've practiced fasting. Um, so immediately I started feeling the effects. And for about a month or two, it was going up rapidly, like my health and quality of life. And then I feel like I hit this wall where I was as healthy as I could be except for like the long-term inflammation that's still kind of going away to this day. So, I feel better every day. Um, but it's just a little bit slower now because there's just like tissue damage that needs to be reversed still. Yeah. And so yeah, you you mentioned that you doctors never ask about, you know, what you're eating, how much water you're drinking, are you getting outside, are you exercising? I think of those as just the basics. Those are just the basic principles. It's like, okay, did you get these right? Okay, that all looks fine. Okay, now we'll look at okay, what is what is the problem that that you know could be on top of that. It's like in sports, you know, I was talking about, you know, the fundamentals, the basics, you know, basketball, you know, passing, dribbling, shooting. I mean, these are just the basics. I mean, you have to know these things. And then once you you have all those things down, you can do the big fancy behind the back, you know, backflip dunk or something like that. But it's just like, you know, you you have to get the you have to get the basics right. And if you don't have those fundamentals, your your game is uh is not is not going to be as good and um you're not going to be, you know, a top competitor. These are the basics of medicine. You know, are you treating your body in a way that is um functional? Is it are you treating your body in the best way possible? If you're not, that's where you start and you start treating it better. You cut out the junk. You start eating eating more nutritious food. You know, get outside, exercise, sleep properly, drink enough water, all these things. It's just the basics. And then your body is sort of working at a normal state and there's still this problem. Great. Okay. Let's see if there's a medicine or medication or a treatment that that might be able to to help that further. And that's what medicine is supposed to be. is supposed to be an addition, an add an add-on, you know, to to go further than our body's able to do just on its own. And um but most people, we've just been been coddled and conditioned to look at medicine as as a mainstay that no diet lifestyle that doesn't make any difference. It's just it's just your body's just going to break down and get destroyed and and you just need medicine. You need these people to figure out a pill to fix your problem. Or people say, you know, like, well, you know, you have diabetes because you're eating all this crap. I was like, "All right, well, I just want a pill. Just fix it." I like, "Yeah, that doesn't work like that." You know, um, you know, that that'd be like like, "Yeah, you know, I broke my arm." Like, "Well, give me a pill. Fix it." Yeah, it doesn't work like that. Stop breaking your damn arm, you know, like stop doing stupid and breaking yourself, you know? And, um, those are the basics. Um, and I, you know, I think more and more doctors are figuring that out. But I mean, literally, this is this is the 3,000-y old concept, you know, roughly, you know, I mean, it goes back to Hypocrates. I mean, this one of the oldest sayings in medicine, like food be thy medicine, medicine thy food. And people just think of that as just some little trit saying, you know, and it's just like, oh yeah, yeah, you know, food, whatever, blah blah blah. That's because they didn't have a pharmaceut booming pharmaceutical industry. They just didn't they didn't know. Um, no, it's it's that's that's that is the fundamentals of health. as a fundamentals of medicine is u making sure the diet and lifestyle are on point in my practice. That's 95% of what I do and it and it fixes 95% of the problems. Now some people have malabsorption issues that have um other sorts of issues that preclude them from getting everything that they need just from their diet or they have um you know some sort of hormonal issue or some under underlying condition. Maybe they don't have a thyroid for instance. Okay. So, there's other things that we can add that we can we can bolster their health with. Um, and that and that's amazing that we have that. You know, 100 years ago, your thyroid went out. That was it. You don't have thyroid hormone anymore and and you'd probably die, you know, and so and get very sick anyway if um if you had a little bit. So, you know, there there are amazing things that we can do and should do and should use these these medications and medicines responsibly, but those aren't the basics. you know, those are the, you know, those are the the, you know, the slam dunk competitions at the end of the year. Like the basics are just, you know, fundamentals on the court, you know, the passing, shooting, you know, setting picks, all these sorts of things, these very basic things. That's what food nutrition is. And you don't have that right, just you you're not going to play well. It's not going to be good. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. There's no band-aid that'll fix it if the the cut keeps getting worse. Like I think pe people want to keep eating the way they're eating and and get rid of their health problems at the same time. I'm often asked like now that you feel a lot better um can you just go back to a regular diet? And the way I see it is well the regular diet is what got me here in the first place um it's the pleasure is not worth it. It's like, yeah, it's it's an addiction and it's it's a misdirect. Um because people are told that food has nothing to do with it. I don't know why everyone has that thought in their head, but like the people that I talk to, it seems like they've never thought about it that way that that their diet is is affecting their state of being. Um I think people are told that it's genetics for the most part. It's just out of their control. And people love to hear that because then it's like, okay, I'm just a victim to this problem and it's not my fault. But then what you're doing is you're taking the ability out of your hands to to change something about it. And um so it's it's sad that that it's not more widely known that the things that we eat are causing the state of our health today. Um, but at the same time, it's because it's profitable for them to continue with their unhealthy eating habits. Um, so it's hard. It's like we are sold the poison and then we're sold the cure to the poison by the almost the same industry, uh, the Food and Drug Administration. There's a reason why those are grouped together because one causes the other. And um if everybody practiced health and everybody cared about uh the well-being of themselves, their families, and all of humanity, then both those industries probably wouldn't even exist um or at least not in the form that we know them today. Yeah. These global monsters. Yeah. Yeah. Because really, I think what would be beneficial is the old model where you you trade um some of your skills for a cow with the local farmer down the street. It just it's so much more simple. Um it's more effective. It's more costefficient for you and the farmer, especially if there's no middleman. Um, but obviously that's not realistic for the society we have today. It's so large. We have to have like mass manufactured meat products. But, um, me personally, I shop local. I have the ability to buy from a butcher right down the street. And I feel like it's it's tastier. It probably has less toxins. It's fresher. Um, you can tell the quality when you shop local, I think. Yeah. And, um, it's also, yeah, it's also good to support, you know, local farmers, ranchers, and and butchers and things like that because we don't support them, then, you know, even we get everybody to realize how important carnivore is and we don't have that infrastructure because we haven't been supporting these um these small industries, um, then, you know, we're not going to have the the supply that that we need. Um, you know, eventually they'll catch up though. But yeah, the um, you know, the thing is is that I I don't think that the pharmaceutical companies should look at this as as a threat. I mean, of course they do, like, oh well, this going to hurt our bottom line and blah blah blah. No, what it what it will do is is force their innovation in a direction that will actually benefit humanity as opposed to just covering up problems that shouldn't exist in the first place. it will say like okay well these problems go away if you just change your diet right okay well what about the things that don't what about these things that people are still suffering from they're still having problem go that we look into you know the you know the longevity movement things like that I mean that's that's that's big industry you know people are spending a lot of money trying to trying to you know biohack and things like that well what if actual pharmaceutical company you know put millions of dollars into you know large scale you know trial to actually find out you know does NMN and you know make certain health improvements and you know can this you know you know ostensibly extend life and things like that you know um obviously they want things that are patentable so they're not going to sort of you know put money into something that anybody can can then take their um you know take their work and profit from um so I understand that but you know it will drive things in a direction that is actually beneficial to humanity and that I mean that's that's the whole point is is trying to just, you know, I mean, tens of trillions of dollars that are just going down the toilet, creating a problem and then treating a problem that you've created. And it doesn't even treat it. It just sort of mitigates it. And um and that is just such a dumb model. I mean, it makes these people money, but it's just it it's just a burden on society. Whereas if you took that money and you directed those tens of trillions of dollars every year uh in a more useful direction and you didn't have all those lost opportunity costs and you didn't have all those early deaths stemming from this and then had and lo loss of productivity for the next 30 40 years um for each individual I mean think about that I mean think about how much human capital that we would have think about how much you know you know cash you know we would have to go into directions that would actually benefit humanity and people would say, "Hey, I want that. Yeah, let's do that." Yeah. I mean, it would just be insane uh what we could do. But but that I think this is this has really stifled human innovation. I mean we we've come so far in the last you know century but we don't realize how much we've been held back at the same time a from you know uh from this this sort of planned obsolescence things breaking down only like slowly coming up like putting out the Intel one instead of the Intel 3 when you had it. Um you know blocking things like appra from changing the game and all of a sudden having 400 miles to the gallon and all that sort of stuff. Um, but also, you know, with the with the food and drug companies, you know, we're selling people poison and they're getting poisoned and then we're we're selling them medication that sort of keeps them going, but, you know, they they're miserable and they're not as productive and and you just they're just wasting money, you know, because it's just it's just, you know, it's just um it's just forcing people to spend more and more of their money on, you know, just staying alive and functional. when they should have been healthy and functional the whole time anyway and then they could use that money for something else. They couldn't, you know, god forbid invest it and then invest in their own future or, you know, buy other things as well. So, it's that has seriously held us back. Tens of trillions of dollars a year that we're spending on this stuff. Um, and you know, similar amounts going back decades, you know, 40 years at least. And um you know, think about how much we could have done if that just actually went into like a fruitful direction as opposed to just this, you know, you know, digging a hole and then filling it back up again. You know, it's it's just pointless. It's a it's a pointless industry. And um if we actually had if we sorted that out and actually had a point to it, you know, we would have massive, you know, human innovation. And um there's so much manpower, there's so many very smart people and so much money behind this, you know, dig a hole, fill it back up premise of of um healthcare that we have today that um a food and drug sort of industry now that um you know that that if you actually put those very smart people and that money in like a actual useful direction, just let them go, it'd be amazing. It'd be absolutely amazing what we would have come up with. I mean, yeah, we would have been like the Jetsons. the Jetsons. It was like this future people that were like living in these crazy highrises on Jupiter and you just fly your car to Jupiter back to Earth or something like that. That was supposed to be in 1997. I mean, what high hopes they had and you maybe would have had a lot more um than we do now. But um you know, I think that that what was that car team back in like 60s or 60s7s? Yeah, I remember the Jetsons. I was born in 2001, but it was still airing on TV a little bit. I think your your take on this situation is so interesting because it comes down to like a character issue that's that's within humanity itself. Like in every industry, in every society, it's almost like let's take an example of like a small tribe. They're hunting with with tools like sticks and spears and stuff, but then one man invents, let's say a gun, but then the people selling the tools are like, "Okay, this gun is going to make us go bankrupt, so we need to suppress that technology." But there's the timeline that if they were to allow the innovation, the tribe itself as a whole would become so much more advanced so quickly that even for them, they would be richer and more prosperous than if they continued to have a monopoly selling sticks. So, humanity is so focused on what's happening right in front of them that they can't see the future industries that are beyond when when everybody's super healthy. They're like, "We're going to lose money because we can't sell them sell them these pharmaceuticals." But it's like like you were saying, there's other things to come when we get past these issues. There's more money to be made in new industries if we can just adapt. And it's not all about money. it's just about progress for humanity. Maybe it's just your family that you care about or or just you as an individual. But even for you as an individual as the collective is allowed to progress in a free market without suppression, um it's better for for society as a whole, which will benefit you. So, anybody out there that has this restrictive mindset of of suppressing change because they think it's better the way it is, I think we always find a way to make something better. There's always going to be more prosperity in in a free market without manipulation, without suppression. If everybody was healthy, they would make less money on pharmaceuticals, but they would make more money in something else that's that's going to come along. Um, and as soon as we can get out of this mindset, then I think we will start to see the Jetsons. It's probably already possible right now. I'm sure that we have all these technologies that could change everything if we weren't competing with the future by trying to maintain the present. Hey everyone, really happy to announce a new sponsor for the show and for everybody down in Australia. It's Stockman Steaks, who are delivering high quality grass-fed and finished, pasture-raised beef and other meats, flash frozen, and vacuum sealed to your door. Something I've been enjoying a lot of myself recently as well. They also have a great range of specialty items such as highfat keto mints and carnivore beef and organs mints with liver, kidneys, and beef heart as well. So, use code chaffy today for a free order of beef mints or another specialty gift along with your order at stockmanstakes.com.au and I'll see you over there. Thanks, guys. Mhm. Yeah, I sort of was thinking about that when you said that like um you know the entire premise of of of free market is that is it just people just make their own choices. I mean that's oh capitalism people don't understand what actually these things are. Everything's about money. you know, these are different systems of economy or just different ways of generating money and using resources in a scarce environment and taking which resources you're going to use. Free market system uses those those resources the most effectively out of any system that's ever been um sort of come up with and um and the whole point about about the free market is it is free. You're free to make your own decision. Merkantalism, you have like the government sort of pushing monopolies and things like that. You know, something that China does. um you have um you know communism where the government just controls and micromanages everything. You do not have a choice in what's going on. The government chooses everything for you. Um the free market you have a choice. You don't have to buy that. You can buy that if you want or you don't want to. So the the the better product wins out. The better product at the better price wins out. And so you have to provide a really good uh product. And so it's it's forced altruism. like you have for you in in order in a true free market system for you to make money you have to provide something that's really beneficial to people that they are willing to pay you for over someone else right and um and so you know it's not about oh greed no communism is about greed mercantalism is about greed because the government's forcing certain things to to win or lose um and um free market is about providing things that are better that people just choosing what they want and um so you can be the greediest person in the world doesn't matter if you don't have a good product you know so it forces that greedy person who just wants to make a lot of money it forces them to make make a product that's really helpful and useful for people that's the idea um and so that and that's how people make the most money the the wealthiest people in history have done that you know Rockefeller the reason he had 92% of the market share for oil back in the 1800s was because he kept making the cost of oil and kerosene cheaper and cheaper and cheaper and cheaper and cheaper. And that's why he had 92%. Oh, he had a monopoly. No, he did not have a monopoly because monopoly is that you have the market, you own the market, and then you start raising prices to, you know, to gouge people. Prices were coming down when he had 92% of the market share. his uh Standard Oil, his company Standard Oil in the early 1900s, so 30 years later um when they said, "Oh, you're a monopoly. We're gonna, you know, do this trust busting stuff under Taft, they um they only had like 27% of the market share, you know. So, how's that a monopoly?" And prices were still coming down, you know. So, you know, it's the reason he had most of the market share is because he he was making things better and better and better. So, people went to him because it was a an actual true free market. um you know Bill Gates as crazy as he's gotten you know he didn't get his money by stealing from people now he's done weird crazy things since subsequently but just Microsoft itself had to had to provide benefit you know revolutionized you know get brought about the personal computer revolution you know he really was on the on the front um the front end of that and um you know Bezos all these other people these are these are products that these are companies that have provided more benefit to people and and allowed them to uh you know help their life somehow and so they were willing to put their money into it. That's how you do that. Doesn't matter how greedy they are. It forces them to do something that's beneficial. Now the problem is with the food and drug companies is that we're being told that this is really good for you and all that sort of stuff. And yes, people can choose the junk food and it's very addictive. And so when you're sort of given a choice of just a bunch of like heroin and cocaine in the store and and you're told that it's totally fine, it's actually good for you. Like yeah, absolutely. You know, get more of that. That's sort of what's happening now. Um and you know Pepsi and you know Coke and all Pepsi alone I know they have something like a $2 billion marketing budget like worldwide. So a lot of that goes into into studies and into you know you know pushing their narrative and that's why you know diet sodas, diet coke, diet Pepsi have like a four star out of five star rating for as like a health food. So this is like this is not only like it's not bad for it's actually a health food. It's a super healthy for you. It's like are you out of your mind? Like you know diet soda that's that's a health food. Okay. Um but they they pay money to s sort of get these things um you know recognized like that you know because people look at that and go oh okay it's good for me and they fool themselves and then the drug companies they've manufactured that sense of altruism right you know if you if you provide things if you make a product that provides benefit to people and they want it they'll say yes I'm going to get that but now you sort of have this force situation where they sort of almost have to do it so yes you're providing benefit by getting these medications by getting these, you know, immune suppressants for autoimmune conditions and diabetes medications and all that sort of stuff. But that that need is only there because people are are hurting themselves and damaging themselves and and you're not trying to fix a problem, you know, that people would say, "Yes, I want that hepatitis C. Yes, let's cure that." Whatever. It's like, "No, no, we're just going to treat the hepatitis C for the rest of your life." And so they've they've, you know, they they've sort of made this, you know, this um this industry inside of a free market system that appears as if, you know, we need it, we want it because, well, there's no other there's no other game in town, you know, and so that is a monopoly, right? Because they don't have any competition. But now there is competition when people are saying, "Hey, just change the way you eat. These problems go away. You don't need that medication in the first place." you know, and then people pointing this out saying, "Hey, you're only treating symptoms on purpose, and we don't want that, and we we're not going to support that." And um and so we're going to go to this other thing and just just not have the problem in the first place. And um until you sort of sort yourself out, you know, we're going to try to avoid you as much as possible. And um and so that's starting to happen. And and I think that's that's why you see all these these people attacking carnivore diet or attacking low carbohydrate diets, all these sorts of things because it it's a big big business. Um even just the cereal companies, the processed food companies, they hate ketogenic diet uh movement because it it just destroys their cereal sales, their sugary sales. And um you know, they pay off the American Heart Association to to make claims that are completely unfounded. um you know going back to their inception saying that seed oils and Crisco were good for your heart and that their direct competitors butter and lard were bad for your heart based on no evidence whatsoever. They just they just made a statement. They got paid equivalent of $20 million for it. They um they lied and said the Framingham study showed that increased cholesterol uh was associated with increased cardiovascular disease mortality rate when in fact it showed the opposite that lower cholesterol was associated with higher um cardiovascular disease mortality rate. But the AHA's um lie is what's taught in medical school right now, right? 40 years a after the fact. And um you know, and then most recently, you know, they're trying to get um sodas taken off the SNAP program, the food stamp program in America. And um because the number one product, they're like, "Oh, well, if somebody wants to enjoy, you know, a soda every now and that's not the only thing they're buying, you know, it's just every now and then they want to have it. It's a complete and utter utter lie because the number one uh item that is bought on the SNAP program is sodas, right? Number one. And so that that's billions. They're getting billions of dollars off the off the SNAP program. Um and um and so they they they're they're pushing really hard to to keep their strangle hold on that. And uh and so they again paid off the American Heart Association or seemingly because the American Heart Association sent represent representatives to these things going we oppose this bill because this is about freedom of choice and it's not actually addressing any underlying you know um health issues and concerns and people were like I never thought that I would ever hear the American Heart Association defending sodas and the SNAP program whatever they got such backlash from this they were like oh maybe we maybe we messed up here we can't work in the dark and just people without them realizing. And people are waking up now. And so they're like, "Oh, that was a misunderstanding. You guys misunderstood what we're talking." We're actually we're actually very opposed to that. No, we don't. We don't support that. Dude, you you literally said point blank that, you know, we oppose this bill and this should not be you should not restrict it. Whatever. It's just But you know, you know, how much do you want to bet that that was that was paid bought and paid for? I I think that is the chances of that are 100%. and um you know because that's just that's just their MO. So they're trying to protect this this industry and and force people into um a position where they don't they don't feel they have a choice and Yeah. And that's what we need to break. Yeah. And it's almost like we have a choice but we are misinformed about what our choices are and we have all the wrong information behind what choices we're making. So, is it really a free market when we're told by our own government the sodas are healthy for you? Mhm. And it's like it's a free market, but it's like people are choosing what they want, but they're making a decision based off of pleasure and not health. So, like it's what's healthy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like the food pyramid like that was from the government directly like was I think Michelle Obama in the Obama administration. It's we're given this food pyramid of like this is biologically what we should be eating. These are your priorities and and if you look at like the list of like the healthy foods categorized like Cheerios is like up there like above eggs above above steak. So it's like we we are lied to and we're misinformed. And then there's also partnership between these these corporations that are selling us this poison and our own government. So really, um, the the mask has been pulled over our eyes because it's it's easier to make money selling addictive chemicals and processed things with higher margins than it is to have a healthy civilization. That's that whole industry would just go away. So, so if you follow the money, you you find the truth. You realize that it was all set up this way um with selfish intentions and um that's why everyone's misled about what we should be eating. And um if as long as they still feel good about eating this processed junk, then there's still money to be made. Um, and then like you said, there was actual um, precautions taken to prevent the carnivore diet from ever coming to be with misinformation. Um, everybody always asks me like, "Okay, when are you going to die? Like, when are you going to die of deficiencies on this carnivore diet? Like, how long can you do this until you just can't do it anymore?" And I just laugh at them and I don't even know what to say because it's like there's just too much misinformation to fight. So I just like laugh it off and I'm like yeah like I just make some funny joke because it's just too much to even get into. Um everybody is just so misled and it's really not the fault of the individual but like the system that we are part of the the experts that that were taught by the the guidelines created by the people that want to make money off of our being misled. It's it's really disgusting and it almost makes you you seem like a conspiracy theorist um talking about biology and talking about food and nutrition and health nowadays um because there's such extremes. There's no like clear answer. You either you trust the experts and you believe what I think most of society believes and then every other opposing viewpoint is just a lie. or if you're on an opposing viewpoint, then you see that the standard is a lie. And it's a war of information that goes so far beyond even health and and the medical industry, but um that's probably a conversation for another day. Um I was going to ask as well, um how are you now? How are you doing now? And how long has it been since you've been on carnivore? And and and how's it been going? It's been going amazingly. I feel like it's a superpower. I would recommend to anyone listening to give it a try, but you got to get past the first two weeks. Just jump straight into it and and have faith. Watch all of Anthony Chaffy's videos and you'll have enough information to get through it. I have so much energy and so much mental clarity and I don't eat very often. I spend all my extra energy back into things that make my life better. I've traded pleasure for fulfillment. Um, all my addictions are gone. Uh, it built a discipline within me where now I'm focused on health and I'm focused on power. Um, because my mindset has shifted. When you get rid of the most intense addiction, which is food, everything else seems to follow. Pretty much all my health issues are gone. I think my lungs are still healing. um a lot of soft tissue damage and a lot of that was my own fault. I used to smoke um do things that I shouldn't have done definitely. But um it really has changed my life. Probably the best thing that's ever happened to me and my brother would say the same. My little brother went from never ever ever left the house no matter what for. He had no friends because he couldn't couldn't go out. He had to drop out of school like myself and was suicidally depressed to now just I think eight months later he's doing doortodoor sales in a different state right now like hustling killing it like better than more disciplined more healthy than anyone I know. He went from on his deathbed to healthier than anyone I know purely because of our diet. So, you literally saved both of our lives. And also, thank you Jordan Peterson and Michaela Peterson and Sean Baker for doing what you do for this community and for humanity as a whole. People need to know these things and um perhaps your life might be even in danger. I would hate to um even put that thought in anyone's head, but like you are fighting against corruption in a way that is so heroic and I could not be more grateful and and more proud of you and your movement and also Bobby Kennedy um really fighting against the lies about the about what we should be eating and trying to put a stop to that. So, highly recommend the carnivore diet. It's really the only way to to go, I think. um maybe a little bit of cheese sometimes and and eggs, but um it's really it's really not that bad. It can be totally sustainable once you're a couple months into it. I don't crave anything ever. I look at things at the grocery store like it's a toy, like it's plastic, like it's not food. My body doesn't even recognize it as food anymore. People always ask me like, "Is it sustainable?" after a couple months it is well and also you know uh what was sustainable about the way you were eating before when you were sick and bedridden couldn't breathe felt like you were suffocating all day how how is that sustainable you know um he's like oh but what if you want to eat something numb like are you two like what is wrong with you like I'd rather be able to breathe thank you and be able to leave the house and and not uh be bedridden and suicidal that's not that's not sustainable I mean Jesus, you know, people people think that there's like, you know, that that there's no alternatives don't exist, right? So you you pick one way. Oh, but that's not sustainable. Okay. Well, what happens then, right? Okay, you stop doing this and what's the alternative is that yeah, you're eating some cupcakes and you're and you're bedridden and can't breathe and want to die or and may die, you know, like what what is wrong with your brain? You know, the only sustainable thing here is like is getting away from that and being healthy. Um, it's it's mindblowing to me that that people look at this and they see you and see how you were before. They see how unhealthy you were and how miserable you were and now you're healthy and you're out there and you're vibrant. You're going like, "This is amazing." And you're shouting it off the rooftops and they're just like, "Yeah, but how long's that?" You know, it's just like, "Well, it's obviously better than whatever the hell else I was doing." Yeah. Yeah. It's almost like the heroin addicts are coming to me like like uh don't you miss it? Like are you going to go back um now that you're you're sober? Like uh is it sustainable being sober? Yeah. Yeah. It's funny. Like it's it's very sustainable. I feel much better. I'm I'm not dying anymore. It's truly a miracle. Yeah. Well, that's great. like there was a that reminds me of um a standup standup comedian Nick Schwarzson. Really funny guy, really funny guy. And um he um and he, you know, had been like a, you know, pthead, things like that. Smoked a lot of weed with his friends. And then one day he was just like I was like, I got to I got to cut this out. I've just got to, you know, quit. And so he he decided to quit pot. And all his like, you know, pot smoking friends were like, "Wait, what? Like you're just you're just quitting? You're like you're done? like, "But you're going to you're going to start again, right?" Like, "But what?" Like, "Oh, that's all that sucks, man." He's like, "Yeah, it really sucks knowing where I left my keys, you know, and like and being able to actually like do normal things throughout the day." Like, yeah, that really sucks. And um uh you know, it's the same thing. It's like, "Oh, but oh, but it's just like, what do you think is going on here?" I mean there there's a reason that that you know you've done this and millions of people around the world are doing this now that that is massively improving their life you know and they obviously felt that whatever the hell else was going on in their life that was not sustainable that that was not working that that needed to stop that had to go and so they made a change and then you know and and you know you did a number of different things it wasn't like you just you know it's like I you know these people make this claim largely vegan that you know the only benefit from carnivore diet is is that you're just cutting out the junk food and that's it. No, that's that's that's projection is what it is is uh because the only benefit to a vegan diet is you're cutting out the junk food. It's not cutting out meat. Cutting out meat does not provide benefit to your health by any stretch of the imagination. And um by any metric, you cannot say that cutting out meat provides health. Cutting out all the other crap at the same time that can that can provide benefit. But you did that, you know, you already you already cut out the junk. You went to the crazy ass med medical medium diet. I mean, like anytime, you know, you're getting medical advice from the voices inside your head, you know, probably not a guy you're you should be listening to, right? He literally says that. He says he gets he gets his information from the spirit of compassion. Is the spirit of compassion a a dietitian or a doctor? Like what's their qualifications besides being compassionate? um you know just like and uh and they're getting this and and this voice is speaking inside of their head and and you're just like oh wow yeah like how is how is this guy so popular that blows my mind and people are saying oh my god it's amazing it's like you do understand that he's saying he's saying that he gets his information from voices inside of his head usually that gets people locked up right yeah well but it it's also crazy, you know? It's like you're hearing voices and it's just telling you to do things. It's like, okay, are those voices in the room with us now? You know, it's like, yeah, this is is the spirit and compassion in here now? Do you see them? You know, it's just like I mean, this is a crazy person. So, it's either, you know, certifiably insane. Should probably go on a ketogenic carnivore diet to help get rid of the voices in his head. Um, or he's a con artist. And um and I would probably bet a ladder, you know, and but for some reason, you know, people look at that and they think like, "Oh yeah, I'm I'm going to get on this." You It's wild. It's wild to me. Well, that just shows that just shows like how desperate people are for like something else. Yeah. But, you know, but that's the thing, you know, to your credit, you tried all these things. You know, you went, you know, medical medium, you know, celery juice, you know, diet and um and you know, the the alkaline vegetarian, vegan sort of thing. You did all those things, you know, and and you saw exactly that. You saw some improvements getting rid of the junk food and cleaning things up and and getting some crap out, you know, and fasting for periods of time. Like, wow, look at that. That's helping as well. So, there's obviously something in your food that's causing this problem. if you can fast and stop eating and those problems start to resolve. There's obviously something in the food that you're eating that's causing this and is the cause and so trying to figure that out and it just wasn't quite getting there. It was better but it wasn't quite finished and then you went carnivore and that's what did it, you know? I mean, so that's that's a very good demonstration of what's going on here. and um and um you know so I think that's that's you know really powerful especially coming from how sick you were and how many things you tried already and you landed on this because that was that was what actually uh gave you the most benefit. Yeah. Yeah. And it was one of your videos um I think it was an hour long like why we are carnivores. You go through like biologically um society just everything. It just made so much sense to me and just right then and there my entire mindset shifted and um I think it's I've heard you say this before. It's not that meat is just some magical like cure to all diseases. It's that the body has the ability to heal anything within itself. You just have to sustain a ketogenic state because um that's when it really starts to do the work. Um, so it's anybody that knows anything about fasting, like your body is fasting when you're not eating sugar. Um, so I think it's truly miraculous what happens when you hop on the carnivore diet, especially if you understand what's happening within the body. Yeah. Well, and also, yeah, I mean, that's that's it's sort of funny. you know, some people that that are the detractors of a carnivore diet, I've heard them say, "Well, all a carnivore diet is really is it the only only thing that's um that is doing is just getting rid of things that are harmful." Like, yeah, that that's the whole point, you know? Just you're you're you're eating things that are harmful. Um and eating only meat gets rid of those harmful things, right? Not eating meat and vegetables. The vegetables have harmful things. There are other harmful things, too, especially in processed garbage food. But it's not just that. You know, there are people on ketogenic diets. It's not even just carbohydrates. It's not even just seed oils. It's not even just whatever. Because people can be on completely clean, omnivorous diets. They don't use seed oils. They don't use sugars. Um, and uh they're unwell. They have autoimmune issues. They have, you know, diabetes. And they go ketogenic, clean, no seed oils, all these sorts of things. Massive improvements. A lot of things get better. And then, but they're still having autoimmune issues, and they're still having this, and they're still having that. And then they cut out the vegetables, just the just the vegetables. Massive difference. Everything changes. That I experienced that personally. And um you know, and so and then you sort of retrial in okay well what about this season? What about this? Nope. Nope. Nope. Absolutely not. That makes me feel like crap. It's pretty clear, you know, and so you know that that is 100%. The entire point, you know, so they they're like, you know, I go around saying to people like, "Hey, you're eliminating out things that are harmful to your body." And then the detractors say, "All the carnivore diet does is eliminate things that are harmful for your body." I'm like, "Yeah, idiot. That's the whole point." That's exactly what we're talking about because these things do cause harm. And um no one's saying that that meat is like, you know, uh you know, ambrosia from the gods and things like that is just like a healing potion out of Zelda, you know? It's like it's just nutrition. It's just giving your body what it needs. And when you give your body what it needs and the nutrients and vitamins and minerals and that and having a lack of those having a posity of vitamins and minerals can cause harm and disease long before you get like a full berry berry or you know deficiency that um you know can be life-threatening. Your your body is is curtailed your health is curtailed by just having a you know a sort of aosity of these things just a lower level of these nutrients that you actually need. So getting the proper nutrients in the right proportion that is beneficial. Your body can run properly, but it's as important what not to eat as what to eat. It's those two things. Just it's basic nutrition. Just giving your body what it needs. And that's a stake. That's that's you know, we need a balance. A balance of what? A balance of good and bad. No, you need a balance of nutrients, vitamins and minerals, proteins, and fats that in the right proportions. And that's a steak. You know, a fatty meat, you know, maybe a bit of organs every now and then. Not not much. you don't need much. That is a balanced diet. And um it's a perfect balance of all the nutrients you need. And then just as importantly, you need to eliminate things that cause harm. And that's why we do this of just eating meat because the meat gives us just what we need and that provides benefit. And the other things cause harm to varying degrees, but they cause harm. And so, yeah, I was like, all all the carnivore diet does is is um, you know, just give you nutrition and then, you know, get rid of things that harm you. Very well. Very well said. And 100%. You know, that's how we do it. Yeah. Yeah. I've heard people say that. People say that to me all the time. You're just eliminating the toxins. And I'm like, well, yeah, that's that's a lot of it. And but also like I think you're doing is getting rid of lead. You know, you're just getting rid of that lead. You're not actually curing lead poisoning. you're just not you're just, you know, getting rid of the lead. Like, oh my god, do you listen to the words that are coming out of your mouth? Like, yeah. And and you're eliminating the food that these diseases feed off of and and so like you're actually starving them out once you get rid of the rest of the vegetables. I think um Dr. Peterson was eating everything um slowly eliminate everything except for I think like kale or or lettuce. So, it's just steak and lettuce. And he still felt terrible. And so it's like, is it just the toxins in the lettuce that's making him feel terrible? No, it's that the lettuce had something in it that was able to keep alive the diseases that were attacking his body and then once he got rid of that, they all started to die. That's or at least that's my theory. Yeah. Well, and you know, and um whatever the reason, it helped, you know, and he got a lot of help by going, you know, eating a lot of, you know, fatty meat and um being ketogenic and just eating, you know, big salads and a steak. Um but, um as I remember the story, he said he was still having crippling anxiety and, you know, massive health improvements in other regards, but um still had this crippling anxiety. And um his daughter Michaela went, you know, just meat and water and, you know, massively improved her condition and then just said like, "Well, this is stupid. Salads don't hurt me. Salads can't be bad for me." She had a salad and then bam, had a rheumatoid arthritis flare up the next day. And it was just like Jesus. And so she, you know, told her dad about it and just said, "Hey, why don't you just try this? You just try for 30 days and see what happens." And he was just like, "Okay, yeah, screw it." And um you said after about three weeks his anxiety was was gone and and his salad was doing this to me like what the hell. So you know that's the thing you know whatever whatever the reason is whatever the mechanism is it it it's there and you know people are just seeing this massively and you but that's always the thing it's just like you don't need a course you don't need a program. I I hate people that are trying to like, you know, charge people $2,000 to like, you know, do some This is all available for free online, you know? I mean, even I even with, you know, my little course, like I try to make it as as as affordable as possible. And I I tell people, look, you know, this stuff's available online. And the only thing that you're getting um new from me are like the coaching groups, the Q&A sessions with me and with with um you know other experts and things like that um that can give you more sort of you know guidance and and more personalized care like that's it you know like all the information is available for free online as it should be you know uh because this is this is you know um you know this is this is the world's you know sort of heritage. It is a fundamental um you know right to just be healthy like we we you know our birthright is to be healthy. You know we we were born healthy with the ability to be healthy with the potential to be healthy. Um the vast majority of us and um the vast majority of us are sick and unwell. So we're being robbed of our birthright. And so you know it's not something I'm trying to profit off of. You know it's just it's just like the people should know this. That's why all my videos are available for free. You know, the only thing that um that we charge for is is just more personalized time to help people on a on a more onetoone or group basis. Like that's it. And it actually really really bothers me when people take free information that that I and others provide and usually get it wrong and tell people to do things like avoid fat and like fat's bad for you. It's like the same idea of just well fat's bad, fat makes you fat. doesn't actually. It's the only macronutrient that doesn't make you fat. It's the only macronutrient that does not raise your insulin. And uh and they they say, "Oh, fat increases insulin." Like, and what biochemistry textbook did you learn that in? I doubt that you've ever opened one because it's it's not true. That's a that's a verifiable falsity falsehood. And and they're charging thousands of dollars for information that, you know, I and others provide for free. um this is this is the right of humanity is to just be healthy and just to understand basic nutrition and basic health and then on top of that if you have a problem that can't be fixed by your own body healing it and just having you know proper nutrition you're checking your nutrients like oh crap you know like even though I'm eating all this stuff my B12 is still too low okay well you know it could be a malabsorption issue pericious anemia something like that I've diagnosed three people already with pernicious anemia uh because you know they just eat they just eating beef and and their B12 is is too low and then they're adding liver into that. It's still too low. It's just not moving anywhere. And it's just like, okay, what's going on? You check them and sure enough, they've got pernicious anemia. And um they're going to have to have injections or, you know, sublingual B12. And that's just something you need to know. So, you know, that's something that, you know, testing and and uh and so on can help with, but you know, after that, you don't have those issues. You just, you know, you're just healthy. And then there's things that you know maybe on top of that and that's what you need doctors for. Um but people should just be healthy. You know people you know deserve to just be healthy and deserve to know this. It's it's you know it's something that you know people knew inherently knew just through you know the wisdom of the ages like this is just meat is important fat is important and um I've tal I've spoken to you know Australian Aboriginals and you know talking about you know this sort of thing and they're just like yeah well that's always what it was you know like you know my grandparents were always like really lean and strong and healthy they just ate they just ate meat like that was it they didn't eat any of this other stuff and they told me that the most important part was the fat. And I was like, couldn't agree with you more. And um and so that's, you know, that's these native populations saying, "This is what we went for. We went for the fattiest bits and we went for the fattiest, healthiest animals that you get, you know, because the stronger, healthier an animal is, the more uh fat it's going to have on them." And they went for the fattiest parts as well. And um you know, that was always the prized the prized part of it. So, you know, it's um you know, this is just something that that um that uh people people deserve to know. And um and I think it's important to I think that um hopefully within my lifetime hopefully within the next 10 20 years we can get people to the point that everyone just understands how what healthy nutrition is and people can just be healthy and these pro these chronic diseases will be largely a thing of the past and we can get medicine back to where it was supposed to be which was dealing with all the other things and um actually helping and benefiting humanity and that's going to be a really interesting time because then medical innovation is going to be able to move so far forward and um and actually make true advances. Right now, the only advances that we make in medicine is um is these chronic diseases because that's the main stay of the issues that we deal with now. And so, we're researching chronic diseases and what pill does this and what genetic factors and blah blah blah. It's just a waste of time because if you just eat properly, 90% of them will go away. And so if we just fix that then all of a sudden we have very different problems to face and we can actually focus on those actually focus on the problems that that our body can't heal naturally you know and uh you know better ways of of healing from fractures better ways of dealing with you know aging populations and development and you know different sort of developmental delays and and you know congenital issues you know whatever there's this we don't even know what the landscape will look like because you know we have no idea um you know what we're going to see what's going to be sort of what's going to shake out and be left over that we can actually go, oh, okay, well, this is what we're dealing with. And then you're going to have people they can take those that those brilliant innovative minds and actually go forward in a direction that actually benefits people past, you know, just fixing the problem that we've already caused. And that's what I'm I'm really looking forward to. I would like to see that in my lifetime as well. I think it would change absolutely everything if even 30% of this world went back to carnivore which is what we are be huge. Yeah. Well, Andrew, thank you so much for taking the time and uh sharing your story and this is and also just talking went on a few tangents, but you know I I thought it was very interesting and hopefully um viewers did as well. So, thank you very much for that. I really appreciate you taking the time. Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me. Looking forward to your next video. Yeah, not a problem. Um, is there do you are you on social media or anything like that? Is anywhere people can can follow you and see more of your of your story? I don't go on social media as uh as an individual, but I release music. If anyone would like to check that out, that's kind of where I put my my thoughts and my message. So, maybe you can include a a link in the description or something like that. Yeah. Where where's um where can that be found? I have just released it onto Spotify, Apple Music, YouTube, everything as Roga uh on my hat and uh I just released my first album, Roga. I just released my first album. Um I recorded it in Vietnam. Just barely finished it a month ago in Vietnam. Yeah, I just got back from Asia. It was hard to do. It was hard to do carnivore traveling around Asia. But um yeah, finished my album, Got Home, just barely released it. So that's where I kind of put my my heart and my soul and my mind. So if you want more of that, check out the album. We can definitely we can definitely uh put a link for that. And what what genre of music? It's a mix between old school hiphop and psychedelic rock. if I had to put it into a genre. It's very poetic and existential. Um, I'm way into philosophy and it kind of has my world view embedded inside of it. Very cool. All right. Well, yeah, if you send me a link, I definitely put that put that up and u people can check that out in the description. Cool. Great. Well, thank you very much, Andrew. It's been a pleasure. Yeah, thank you. Likewise. Not a problem. And thank you very much everyone for watching. Hopefully you enjoyed that and found it entertaining, hopefully helpful. And if anyone you know is um sort of down and out and and looking for sort of a way out of their situation, please uh send them this or anybody else you think would be interested in in this conversation. Thank you all very much. We'll see you next time. Hey guys, thank you very much for taking the time out to listen to what I had to say. If you like it, then please like and subscribe to my YouTube channel and podcast. And if you're on YouTube, then please hit that little bell and subscribe, and that'll let you know anytime I have a new video out, which should be every week, if not more. And if you could share this with your friends, that would help me get the word out and let me know that you like what I'm doing. Thanks again, guys.