Carnivore Brain Cancer Survivor Pablo Kelly!

welcome to the plant free MD podcast with Dr Anthony chafee where we discuss diet and nutrition and how this affects health and chronic disease and show you how you can use this to optimize your health and happiness both mentally and physically all right hello everyone this is uh Dr Anthony chafee here again with another episode of the plant free MD podcast and today I have a very special guest Mr Pablo Kelly who's joining us from the UK Apollo how are you um very well thank you yeah great so um so it's over those who don't know Apollo has a has a very unique story that I think is going to be very interesting and very helpful to a lot of people to hear and so uh if you would wouldn't mind telling us a bit about yourself and and uh what you've been going through that'll be great sorry my dog's making a lot noise that's all right um yes um uh well start the beginning I guess uh 2014 I was diagnosed with a terminal inoperable brain tumor a chronoplastoma multiform um I uh after a bad deliberation and research decided to opt out of standard of care because what they were offering me was a really poor quality of life and uh the quantity of life as well is very very short they said uh six to nine months of our treatment um uh was then like the 12 months 12 15 with uh chemo and radiotherapy and then all these uh side effects and the fact that I may become impotent um kind of put me off as well yeah so my idea was um if I'm gonna die and I'll die well you know feeling uh or kind of yeah like um generally quite well in my house rather than um being suffering and going for a lot of trauma just from the uh treatment course yeah I mean it took me they said it would take a lot of time um out of my life serving like six weeks I think of treatment on and off and if my blood cells uh they decrease you know my white blood cell [ __ ] uh goes down then I wouldn't be able to have the dream and all this stuff and I was just like why would I put myself through this um um so after the doing some research prior to that meeting in fact like issue was like um I didn't agree to do chemo or radiotherapy they um decided to send me for an appointment so I thought I was going to see my oncologist oncologist to discuss my treatment options what they've done is they'd fast tracked me into the system saying oh he's going to accept it like a standard patient um I had a beard like this and it was the radiotherapy mask fitting and so I got in there and they said it's supposed to be clean shave and I said no one notified me that this was a radiotherapy mask fishing um so they got some offices because they can find a a shaver and they spent about 45 minutes cutting my beard off and then when I go in the room they they modeled the master my face and I kind of went along with it because you know they're professionals I was like I can't really say no um but when I was on the uh the uh the table um underneath the machine uh getting measured up so it was all lined up and correct so they got all the settings um I felt uh a pit of fear in my stomach you know like pure fear and dread and I just said I can't do this um uh thankfully my instinct kicked in they said I want to talk to my oncologist and they said uh we'll give her a call and then I got my answers you know you may become and pretend you'll lose your hair and I was like I don't want any of this and another image popped into my head of my my grandfather um kind of restrained and strained uh is there estranged yeah estranged grandfather um he died of liver cancer I'm on his deathbed I went to see him with my mum and he was completely vacant he did not recognize her he was Skin and Bones there was no muscle he just wasted away um due to chemotherapy and radiotherapy and time it's just it was it's part of the Tourette's that I felt so I just I said I'll write um have you had the KitchenAid ketogenic diets and she said yeah I've heard of it but I don't think it's going to help you at all remind you this is 2014. um and it wasn't it was unheard of being used for um cancer patients at all it's more used for children of epilepsy by mate you know I put two and two together and I was like you know if it's anti-inflammatory why wouldn't it work and it's a healthy brain needs fat yeah um so I just she said yeah it's not gonna I'm not going to help you and I said um well I'm going to take my chances I'd rather do why I feel is best for me than be told what I should do you know so yeah I started ketogenic diets I used uh there's a a charity called Matthew's friends in uh Charing Cross London at the hospital there and they um help children with epilepsy with their children with epilepsy um foundation and uh Sue wood she sent me a load of um information about ketogenic diet you know meal plans reducing it was a restricted calorie ketogenic diet so pretty much started that I went cold turkey on uh uh all sugars really um first day all I had was a stick of celery and some almond butter I kind of just went from there and um within the first week I was sitting uh the one-to-one ratio of um fat and glucose to ketones great bearing in mind I was quite young turning 25 that year um so my metabolism was still pretty fast so metabolism quite well um yeah yeah uh so yeah I started straight away and uh now I'm kind of ketovor because after my second operation the work going out to me I went keto warm uh so it mostly Meats I have a bit of veg in between when I feel like it yeah so you had um so at first you you didn't have surgery or other treatments yeah okay and then 2017 after a scan they said um we um we believe that it's operable now okay it's changed shape or form somehow right okay it's in the motor it's kind of delving into my motor cortex which they said if we go there it's gonna the same weed you know yeah yeah not a good option yeah that was a 2017 2018 I had the operation I think okay so so it shrunk it down a bit and then was able to I don't know if it's shrunk they said they'd change shape that's all I remember strange yeah okay but either way it was you know where it was was outside of yeah and also the uh the surgeon he said you know I've done over 100 um uh brain tumor operations um so it's well experienced and he said you know I feel confident that I can remove some of this yeah okay all right and it wasn't a full resection it was about 83 um so did they get did they initially do a biopsy to get the diagnosis or just started again 2014 yeah September 2014 yeah so the biopsy then okay and um and then so how did you hear about the ketogenic diet helping with cancer in the first place uh I didn't hear about Alvin I met one person there was a random person in tartness um she had a low-grade brain tumor hmm and free Word of Mouth free my mother and my grandmother they they knew some people who worked in a shop in town that's called Green life and they they they kind of like advise people with supplementation stuff and there's one one woman uh called Zoe African a second name but she I believe she's still alive doing well um but she did the ketogenic diet through the uh she got the information from Matthew's friends as well oh great so she he put me on to them and I was like okay cool and then that's how I got started and so so that man that was the only person I'd heard of really that was the only one yeah yeah so that Matthew's friend Foundation you said that was mostly with epilepsy but did they yeah hospital they actually use ketogenic diet the other one of the oncologists is for ketogenic diets but I've not been one in Durban or I live in Devon um no they all say you know chemotherapy radio very is the best option yeah of course yeah well you know it's what has the most data and studies on yeah you know that's fair you know and if you if you want to just go buy that um you want to take the safe you know course but you can liably say well we know that this will give you this outcome or on average give that outcome whereas with a ketogenic diet it's I guess it's more of a of a long shot maybe in their in their eyes but there's certainly more and more evidence coming out and I think just you know just knowing the cancer biology makes sense and even if you were to continuous standard of care as well you could you could at least incorporate this and uh you know as an oncologist it's not going to hurt someone in fact there was a study it was two studies one was in 2019 one was in 2020 and they found that a ketogenic diet helped sensitize the cancer cells to chemo and radiation one was for chemoons for radiation they both found the same results that being on the ketogenic diet helped sensitize the cancer cells to chemo and radiation and help protect the normal cells the healthy cells from the radiation so it actually it was quite beneficial regardless of its effect on treating the cancer itself it's going to it's going to help chemo and radiation for these cancers too so hopefully that well more and more oncologists are are picking this up at my at my department my Neurosurgical Department here in Perth I presented a lot of this stuff to to them in our in our grand rounds and um and you know I was talking to some of the oncologists there so I I invited oncology team Department to come and um most of them didn't respond but one of them did and yeah absolutely you know really interested in this yeah of course of course the ketogenic diet is going to help it's going to just starve out the cell like obviously like we should definitely get a study going on that so you know it is it is making its way around but yeah it's it's uh it's slow moving I think yeah sorry I'm having a few issues I've got like some uh an aura sorry what was that I didn't hear that I got an epileptic Aura coming on so I'm just gonna oh just step outside and get some fresh air yeah why don't we just pause and uh yeah take your time hey guys just want to take a second to thank our sponsor at carnivore bar I don't promote many products because honestly all you need to be healthy is to just eat meat but for those times that you're out hiking road tripping or stuck at work and you want nutritious snack that is just meat fat and salt if you want it the carnival bar is a great option so I like this product not because it's just pure meat but also because I want the carnivore Market to thrive as well and the more we support meat only products the more meat only products that will be available in the mainstream so if this sounds like something you'd like to get behind check it out using my discount code Anthony to get 10 off which also applies to subscriptions giving you 25 off total all right thanks guys okay so um I was gonna ask as well you mentioned that you had two surgeries when was your more recent one your second one uh yeah my most recent one was last this uh last December not last December December before last okay 20 21. was that just a just debulking had it just sort of grown back yeah it's another white cranial to me um uh it didn't they didn't remove all of it because um got to the point where I was doing my hand exercises and I could not move my hand uh my whole arm became disabled left arm um and he said right I'm gonna stop there yeah yeah another good place yeah yeah it was a bit of a traumatic the second operation was more traumatic than the first um the first operation debugged about uh 80 something percent 85 something like that and um I was pretty much Carnival then and within uh a month uh disappeared like it's just reduced down to nothing wow yeah uh but I relaxed the ketogenic diet and within a year I'd put on two Stone weights and I'd also on a ketogenic diet put on weights I've seen too much fat and too much food I was having way too much calories um okay and it came back yeah so my ketogenic diet and just not a carnival yeah that was that was yeah I think yeah no I didn't go carnivore until I had the rear occurrence okay all right yeah so in hindsight if I had been strict and stayed strict at which the what I tell people now is from my experience that if I ever maintained the strictness you know being um not caving into my my addictions um then I would have probably had no visible sign of the tumor for a lot longer yeah and then did you have did you have artificial sweeteners like those keto snack sort of thing no no I stayed away from I went um pretty hard called ketos so I removed um tomatoes onions I you know I went anything that came from below ground but I just declined yeah right okay and then okay and then so and and now you're very close to carnivore but just but still have something yeah I was Carnival before my operation and when I came out um I was eating pretty much ketogenic because I just needed to keep my energy up and try to recover as fast as possible yeah yeah and are you still tracking your gki I am not currently because I've lost my daughter played with um my meter song so before I should really get back on it because um yeah tracking the data is going to be helpful for everybody really yeah and then have you been in contact with uh Dr seifried I think he's he's mentioned your name yeah yeah he's um he's like a point of contact so if I do send him if I've got anything I need to ask him he'll send me some information and have a conversation or is the team who wrote the case study about me um that if I send them the scams they'll diagnose them properly um because my the radiographers there don't don't do a good job that's that's not great I mean one of them apparently is one of the uh he teaches uh radio for students so he's like one of the top uh radiographers in the world oh okay great yeah well it's great to have have access to those guys as well yeah and and see if he's great like he's um I had him on the podcast and I've seen a lot of his talks and read his studies and I just I just you know he's just a first of all very knowledgeable and interesting guy but like you can tell like he just he genuinely cares about solving this problem yeah I met him in London in 2018 when I did a speech oh yeah and he was saying oh do you have a glass of wine no I don't drink I don't do anything like that he's like well you actually um what's the word um it's not strict but you said you're adhering you're actually the pro school and I'm like yeah yeah I mean it makes sense and he said oh yeah I should but he's drinking again yeah right yeah I guess it gets a bit more real you know when you have a you have a real diagnosis to contend with and so then you know you just sort of make it make uh excuses for different things but you know I'm of the same opinion that like why would I put something in my body that's not that's not good for my body or could potentially be harmful to my body I mean addictions overall um are conscious sporting nice so it's um like I need this I need this I need this otherwise I'm not going to be happy it's essentially that's what we tell ourselves and at the minute my struggle is with coffee yeah you know I know it's not doing me any good so I'm gonna stop having it um because my wife has that I'm like oh I can partake in that I just keep telling myself it's fine and then I have issues with like auras and yeah that was that was an interesting thing I I heard from a few different people that they had lifelong epilepsy uh mitigated significantly got well controlled with a keto diet and then found of war and and fully got rid of uh their seizures and were able to come off their medications but then had a cup of coffee and said oh coffee's probably not that big a deal and then bam had a seizure yeah at least for uh for them um and it was like two separate people that were maybe three now we had two have had seizures after that at that point and so they said all right there's no coffee and um you know yeah you don't know what it was in the coffee but you know caffeine was you know originally designed as a as a neurotoxin for an insecticide you know so you know it's going to do something it's something you don't want it you know we're not paying that stuff in our bodies yeah exactly um so when you were when you were tracking your gki were you were you able to keep it down around one below two with just with just diary when when I was Peter Jenneke and I was having I was having a lot more of adding a lot more olive oil and stuff to my meals so I was I was getting my fats right up so I was hitting about or to 4.4 MMO um minimal uh for ketones um so I was matching my glucose my glucose have reduced right now sometimes I went as low as 3.2 glucose oh well which was pretty insane I didn't feel good then like there's like I felt kind of like I was rushing like if I'd taken some ecstasy or something I felt like that was happening to me so the energy was excessive right I didn't really need I wasn't using it um yeah and then um was that just with with the diet or did you did you do periods of fasting as well oh yeah I was uh I didn't fast when I started I was using Ketone supplements so I was using MCT oil and uh keto Force um if I was feeling you know if my glucose wasn't lowering and my ketones wasn't raising um I would say I would take some supplements to to boost my keys ends okay all right yeah because that's you know when when you look at the different case studies and case series and uh and different studies on this it's it does seem to be that people are able to keep that that gki the glucose Ketone index which Seafood safe read um you know uh has a has an equation in one of his in some of his papers strategy yeah you know that um they work quite well and um you know I've read a case series from um when was it Cedar Sinai and it was a number of them I think it was like 15 or 16. hey case reports uh and published in a series of uh mostly high grade uh gliomas mostly TBM and um a lot of them had and this was like sort of second third line therapy they'd already failed care and so this was already a recurrent you know multiple recurrent sort of tumor and and then they get on it and everyone did very well actually and the only people that that didn't do well were the ones that couldn't get their gki down or couldn't couldn't uh you know stay on stay on course like one guy was a had been like a vegetarian prior to that and then had gone keto and was able to maintain it you know for a couple years and actually shrank his tumor down significantly yeah and then he just said okay I can't you know go on with this lifestyle I just I don't really like doing it this way it's very limiting socially so it went back to eating away before and unfortunately he passed away later that year and so you know in your your experience with sort of you know not being as um as adherent to it as uh as you had been before and having you know issues there it just goes to show you that I mean you know obviously that's you know it's not it's a bit it's a bit sort of saddening to see that that happen but at the same time it's it's sort of reassuring that like this is actually doing something because when you stop you know it does it does come back and then yeah that just says okay we'll just get back doing it again those um uh that reminds me of there's a woman um she had a consultation with me and she heard about me through my blog on Facebook um unfortunately right now I can't remember her name it's really frustrating but um she declined all standard of care um because she felt there wasn't right for her and she she got two years extra life um because she she adhered so strictly and she she enjoyed her life way more than uh [ __ ] uh done standard of care but she she sadly passed away due to stress um so she had her husband had a botched um hip surgery and she ended up having to take it take charge of all the accounts and do all the work and you know um the stress of that ended up causing her to decline in health the constant stress and having to work too hard because like you know I bet I don't do a lot of stuff I don't do my wife takes a lot of the load for me because she knows that uh I need to relax essentially I need to heal or try and heal um so when I'm stressed I find that things you know I have Grandma seizures I have all these things that occur um and I find that um situation I'm in now is more stressful because of the uh kind of societal but you know those covered um there was also now the energy crisis which we're being fed lies about and um you know I've got less benefit money because my partner works you know the whole the whole system is flawed and uh you know I may be terminally ill but that doesn't mean I'm any less an important member of society but I'm treated as such yeah I'm sorry you're not yeah that's um obviously that that should not be the case obviously and I'm sorry to hear that um you were saying that um that she contacted you through through your blog um she she joined Misha sakarov's um uh B brain tumor group um he's he does it runs a program where he gets everyone to go full carnivore to eat organ Meats um to uh Lardo and uh lots of broth and the practice Boutique breathing um I met him in London when I met Seaford and he said I mean this guy Pablo Kelly and I really really excited to meet this guy because he's done it all by himself you know he's not he's not had any treatment and he's survived cool and then um one-eyed the reoccurrence um I gave him a call I said you know you said you could help me and he said yeah join my group yeah go stretch carnivore and um he'll do all right yeah and so who's this gentleman I don't think you should Sakura s-a-k-h-a-r-o double f he's a Russian fellow who lives in Denmark or something right now um BJ helps lots of people right and so he has a he has a group um very helpful with any kind of cancer specifically GBM um he's helped someone with um uh blood cancer uh leukemia um an old Canadian guy he um he's actually had no progression of cancer so his cells are perfectly fine and he's just very strict he goes to his next little neighbor and he buys uh he gets give he helps cut out the meats so he gets bones for himself and he gets he buys his meat off his neighboring Farm um and he's doing really well as his blood cells uh my blood cells are fine and um they're all surprised they're like surprise days not progressed ends up being worse health and it's just yeah yeah and then yeah it does help different people but it's mainly focused on brain tumors oh wow and so he himself had a brain tumor as well no no he had um sudden athlete death um where he was he was a tennis coach and a football coach uh Semi-Pro and he he was he was running like 10 kilometers one day and he uh his heart slowed down to like but uh really low beats per minute and he is luckily he was found in a hedge I called at the hospital and he said right I need to change my whole Paradigm uh shift my mindset um because why I'm doing is not wrong yeah so he went carnivore he did lots of research he's very intelligent guys so he's just yeah he's helping people um he does a metabolic program as well for anyone who wants to join that nice but it's very simple very clean very effortless stuff but everyone finds it so difficult because it means cutting out all the addictions yeah okay he's got a website it's just his name.com I think oh very cool and so you you are you active on that and you talked about that no no I I can't afford to pay for anything so I don't yeah I left his group um but I'm in contact with him he's a good friend um I started um on his program I was doing a Friday meeting where I would just or the brain team of buddies would turn up and I would host and we'd talk about anything that was stressing us out or our successes or how we can better our our mindset of involving um ketogenic or Carnival diets and breathing techniques yeah so I did that for a while I helped him out a lot yeah and then absolutely just meeting meeting someone like me who's um survived Way Beyond the odds you know six to nine months was why I was told that I would have without chemotherapy and radiotherapy and I'm in my ninth year yeah well that's amazing that's fantastic and and how are you doing now you said that you're you know you're up and around and enjoying time with yourself yeah I'm fully sorry my Frozen yeah I can still hear you I just yeah for some reason uh okay yeah okay James trying to crash uh yeah um so yeah I'm I'm fully functional my left my left arm um my left hand specifically my thumb and my middle finger have a few strength problems um still don't I like pinch them together they uh they don't really I can't feel any power from the operation um and I had a grand I've had one grand mild seizure in nearly two years nice yeah and you were having them regularly before that I was had post uh pre-operation I was having them quite frequently yeah okay um so not having them for ages is quite handy yeah definitely and are you on medications for that uh yeah I'm taking uh something called cerbernex uh okay all right that's great like it's um you know it's one of those things when you when you have an actual lesion there sometimes it's very difficult to control those seizures so it's um you know very beneficial I mean you know you're getting killing two birds with one stone you know we have to have you know good hundred years of you know very good data on the ketogenic diet helping seizures so you know thankfully those are they sort of don't have to do two things it's just the same thing it helps both yeah yeah and then do you do you still speak in those groups you have a like a you know I do I do um kind of uh Zoom consultations uh for 40 minutes on my website um so anyone who's willing to take a chance in their life and do something that actively promotes self in their body and their brain um with brain cancer I've had lots of people over the last three years uh come and talk to me um to ask me why did the anecdotal evidence of me being alive is more than enough to inspire them for hope you know in hopes hard to come by and when you've got GBM yeah yeah definitely well it's good that you're putting yourself out there um to help people like that are you involved I know that um Andrew Scarborough's is trying to get some some human trials going down at Char and Cross hospital um yeah involved with that at all or no no I I don't know anything about that okay yeah but he's just trying to get get some uh some trials going yeah I mean he's in a really good position while he's a medical student and he's got the ability to to do stuff like that which is great because you know if he can get something going then all the bad to put people like me yeah yeah newly diagnose people amen yeah exactly well I mean it is great because there are more and more trials starting up I I've gotten permission from my Hospital Department to uh to get one going so as long as I can get something through the the admission the ethics board I can try and get something going and then there's another one starting up in New Zealand a Canadian guy their neurologist is uh is getting one up just starting and then uh Cedar Sinai Dr Hugh hu is just starting phase two trial they're trying to get like a multi-center several hundred patients uh in going on it as well so I think that that's really the next step is getting that next you'll get the big number of studies where you can we can really say hey this is actually doing something and as soon as we get that you know one big you know seminal study which is just like we have hundreds of patients and well we'll see well I'm confident that it will show benefit but you know because we'll find out but if it does and you have you know it's well-powered well-structured which it which it will be then then that can be and that and I think that will open the floodgates for other other departments to say okay well let's let's let's just incorporate this now and uh and then see what happens so hopefully hopefully that uh that is you know in the next couple years in the pipeline did I lose you here because maybe Frozen even more goodness yeah so like um I've been waiting since 2014 for something to occur that was more um B-Line towards kind of healing the metabolic side of brain cancer um because all of their focus is on new drugs uh new chemicals to combat cancer and obviously uh chemotherapy was derived from mustard gas um I think so you know that's ridiculous that we're playing now in our bodies to try and treat cancer when it's causing more problems I actually have a friend of mine he's uh he's a professor I think at Rice University in Texas I believe and he of maybe biochemistry something like that but he when he was at the University of Washington uh doing his research degree he um they were doing research specifically on scorpion venom and they found that it actually had a high affinity for like GBM cells and so they're trying to figure that out it's like okay well maybe this is something that we can use to Target these GBM cells uh I don't actually know if that that ended up working out but um but yeah I mean you're taking some sort of horrible toxin that just happens to be more toxic to the thing that you're trying to attack than the rest of your it's not ideal any way you look at it um all right well that's great man well um do you have any any sort of anything else you you sort of wanted to say to people that are maybe going through this or know someone who's going through this and just you know just to some piece of uh advice or anything like that I guess like in the beginning uh first thing you should do is um there's much research about uh brain tumors as possible find out exactly what your tumor means um how you can treat it well and focus mainly on your mindset again your mindset right because we get sold when we're diagnosed this is deadly you're gonna die essentially and there's no two ways about it they do they don't give you any hope they're not allowed to within the uh the uh kind of laws of medicine I guess um they can only tell you the facts and the facts from their understanding um together to always ask for a second opinion because your doctor may not always be right and [Music] yeah so like from the offset my mindset because I managed to quit smoking uh started when I was 12 years old because someone shoved a cigarette my mouth and made me smoke it um when I was young so I smoked until I was uh 22 years old and then I quit and I found I found out really hard to do but when I did it I found that my mind my whole mindset and how I approach things my my willpower became infinitely stronger because I was like I can do this I can do anything yeah um because all my friends are doing I had to disassociate myself from any toxic environment uh special Dynamic that I was in um to quit smoking and quit doing drugs because I was doing cannabis and partying hard for most of my adult life My Teenage life um yeah I would say look at meditation look at um you know inspirational figures um there's like Eckhart Tolle you know his his message is all about presence right being present in the moment approving present with anything you do and when you're present with anything you do there's no fear there's no hate there's no there's no lovers it's just you're disconnected from all your your past and your future but you're just here and I try and tell people that being pregnant is the simplest and easiest uh part of being alive it's like instinct Instinct there's being present you know I instinctly instinctually chose not to do standard of care because it's scared the bejesus said about me my my gut my guy Instinct was no this is deadly this is death and I said no um unfortunately for me that was the perfect choice because I'm still here and there was a lot of hard work to get to this point but I'm doing the hard work um the whole time I tried to be as present as possible with my fear of death so my fear of death it crops up when the random of circumstances when I'm like hugging my daughter or my son suddenly they get well if I die and they'll be they'll be they'll be sorrow there'll be pain they'll be suffering for them but then I say this is just the story I'm telling my ego is trying to tell me something pointless it doesn't affect me here and now does it right so every time you know I've just had a scan last uh last Saturday I'm gonna hopefully I'm gonna bring them up on Friday and demand my my results because at the moment because of all this covert restrictions and stuff it's still going on they're very slow at giving me my results even though I don't go and I don't have a basic contact I don't know I don't really have a set I've got my only base contact is my surgeon I don't have an oncologist they took me off the the list which is good because I didn't want to be on it anyway but they don't give me the feedback I need you know the only thing I need from them is my results for my scans yeah and yeah so um hopefully I'll find out what's going on with that and when that happens I'll try and be present with the results because you know I feel that there's been some changes um probably because I've been a bit lacks on my diet so if if there is a change I'm gonna go give myself a kick up the ass and say that's it pure Carnival it's organ meats you know I've been a bit lazy but I've been recovering from a big operation uh where I was uh almost partially disabled yeah so I've been kind of easing that's an excuse not to be more yeah so live and learn um well that's great advice and that's um you know definitely something that that yeah I thought so if people want to get in contact with me I've got a website which if you were posted on your podcast yeah please yeah please what are the one of the best ways that people get in touch with you social media websites things like that yeah yeah yeah to send me a message or something and we'll try and arrange a meeting because um I believe that meeting someone who's done it all what's that you know I've pretty much done it all I haven't done chemo radiotherapy so I don't know what what that's like right but I do understand what it's like I've spoken to over 100 people in my time with uh brain tumors and they'll find my my um with my presence being putting myself out there at the beginning by the way my blog was just me ranting and raving and removing my stresses onto the onto the world and people start listening and going wow this is amazing what he's doing is amazing and then it just kept on kind of smiling and now uh one of the people Google glioblastoma survivors I kind of pop up on their feed which is really good yeah yeah very good and the more podcasts I do I've got three podcasts coming up so I'm trying to put myself out there a bit more just like get the word out because I for some reason it's not being being heard all over the world and I think metabolic approaches to cancer probably the best Best Way Forward I think so and even alongside standard of care because you know it's going to reduce the effects of um the drugs and stuff yeah exactly I mean you know it's only going to help you know safe read um is actually not a fan of standard of care because he's you know surgery debulking yeah but but with chemo and radiation especially the radiation he's not a fan because he he says that it can can make the micro environment around the tumor worse and and more agreeable to a recurrence and uh so you know and it can it can be very harmful you know you can get uh radiation necrosis and that can that can kill you um I've seen a few people die from that there was one lady I think that he wrote up as a as a case study that that she lives quite a long time quite a number of years past what they were expecting and then she ended up you know having you know a period of radiation and and uh chemo here and there but then she ended up actually dying from uh radiation necrosis unfortunately so the tumor that got her it was the the about two years ago I became the longest living men's Survivor that sea freed had heard of you know as a guy named kit um he told me the story there's a guy in Egypt um he did uh keto kind of carnivore for six years he got to the six year mark and because he was doing so well he decided to go and work his Vineyard again and because he didn't have enough time to do the dying stuff um he decided to do radiotherapy and within six months after doing starting yeah radiotherapy he passed away Jesus and see if he believes that it's due to the radiation of the body yeah well I don't I don't know if this was from from that or something else because I don't have all the details but I have a good friend of mine that I've known for you know 20 some years and she she was diagnosed with GBM six years ago and I I told her at the time I was just like hey you know you know this this might help you and um you know something to think about and so she was you know just off and on with it you know you know did keto eat more meat and cleaned up a lot of what she was eating but it wasn't really all that it wasn't strict with it the whole time um had a couple debulkings but then she you know she'd have these periods where she was pretty good with it and at five years you know she had a repeat scan it looked like there was you know no sign of disease which was great she did go through standard of care she did did all the chemo and radiation as well and um as well as diet and then it's sort of in her sixth year it you know it did come back and she's sort of gone off of it and she'd been just you know she was saying hey look I need to enjoy my life I do that I was like yeah of course you need to make that decision for yourself and and then she was just like I shouldn't have done that I should have you know stayed on this and um so she was then she was back on the you know back on the diet and doing it very strict and do very well with it and feeling better with it uh but then she she went in for radiation and uh she she responded very poorly to radiation immediately um she was fine going yeah and it's just every session she got weaker and worse and uh started getting you know the opposite side weakness and uh was just getting worse and worse and unfortunately she's deteriorated quite significantly um I don't I don't know where she's at now I last I heard was from her husband who messaged me and you know thanked me for for all the help over the years and and just you know let me know that she had sort of been checked into hospice care and then you know wasn't doing well so um yeah so that that can be that can be the other other side of the coin you know it's when it when people like yourself say you know I don't really I don't really like the sound of chemo radiation like you know I'm and I can't really blame them you know and and um while I do think that there's there's absolutely a role for standard of care um it's it does not come without risk and um unfortunately it can it can be it can be too much and for her it was uh it seemed to be to be too much yeah I believe that if I was to you know because like if I got a scare where the team was growing rapidly and I decided to do radiotherapy I believe that because my body has not gone through that before the shock the shock on the body and the system would be I overpower my my healing you know any healing that would happen so I'd have a massive inflammatory response that's my fear that's why I'm not going anywhere near it you know if I'm gonna die I will accept I will embrace it I'll still do everything I can to stay alive because that is my will my focus yeah but I'm not going to embrace death by doing something that I believe will kill me yeah yeah well you know and that's and that's the thing is that you you there there are a number of doctors who do the same thing where they and they don't even know about Keto they just say I'm going through that I'm not gonna I'm not gonna do keto on radiation I'm just you know they just you know resign their positions uh you know and do some bank accounts and just just go on and you know yeah trip with their wife and kids and um yeah enjoy enjoy the love of Life yeah that's it and so you know and yet you know that was the thing I've read in a tour but one day one of his books and he's uh you know he's a surgeon over it and um Professor uh surgery over at Harvard and uh wrote a bunch of books uh one was called complications and then better and and things like that and that was one of the things he said he said that you know if you look at statistically doctors are much less likely to accept chemo and radiation when they when they get a cancer done I suggest that it's mad it's a mad one that's it you know and it's just like what would you do you know and and the you know the majority of people with of doctors what they would do is is say stuff it I'm doing something I'm not gonna I'm not gonna deal with that I suppose it depends on on what you had and and you know the if you knew the success rates and things like that and this was like just not really one that like had a very good prognosis then you just be like okay well like you said he's like well I'm not gonna I'm not gonna just waste the last you know yeah I'm gonna suffer more for for a better life yeah exactly and so you might as well enjoy the time that I have as opposed to suffering for more time you know I mean obviously I've had two children in in my nine years and that was unexpected you know that was that was the first uh was like an accidental conception the first uh my Luna Luna um and we were scared of our minds when we we found out we were pregnant it was like what do we do because if I die what's she gonna have and then I said well this is a choice this is this is a chance for me to embrace life more fully you know why not do it and we just said yeah [ __ ] it let's do it let's Embrace Life more because why why be scared of life um yeah yeah absolutely and now now so two kids and yeah yeah Malachi is uh Nelly two um he'll be two in June Luna's gonna be uh five in June yeah that's great yeah well and then they're both kind of Keto kind of semi-keto the potatoes but that's about it really okay um when there were babies they were pretty much keto um we didn't feed them any uh complex carbs um unfortunately because of uh you know going to school she watches people eat all the rubbish that they eat she's kind of got to focus on I want what they're they're having so we can't really force her to to be what we're eating but when she grows up and we we should give her some more understanding she's more able to accomp around what we're saying hopefully she'll follow in our footsteps and be keto or Carnival you know yeah the thing is like them last Christmas she she tore a Lego for turkey they love fats that's the great thing is they love the fat so uh favorite maluna's favorite meal is a rack of lamb oh nice yeah you better bear meat in front of them that's what he eats yeah yeah and then your wife's doing the same sort of dietary she's going Carnival like me she was keto post pregnancy um I need my fixings and stuff yeah yeah and um now she's uh she's got a hearing aids so she's trying to like heal herself at that um but she's gone strict not good yeah and she knows my mom is also carnivore and she's way more strict than me she's very nice she was vegetarian for most of her life yeah um so she eats more liver than I do she's she's fully embraced it and she says she's the healthiest she's about she's ever been oh that's great yeah and did she did she come around to that through your discoveries in YouTube yeah yeah over the last nine years she changed her mind completely she did her own research and she said yeah this makes sense yeah no it does there's some like grounding uh meats you know that's all you really need yeah yeah great so yeah I was going to ask you have the have the blue blocker glasses on you're doing some grounding earlier what are those yeah peripheral uh sort of things do you do to optimize uh your health uh quite a few I think try and get up with the sunrise and you know get the sunlight uh sunrise sunset I give Hawks every day do some um some uh strength training yeah just generally kind of trying to focus on nasal breathing abdomen breathing um reducing my hyperventilation because obviously the uptake of nitric oxide to the brain can be healing but uh my mum does a lot of research so anything she hears that's that's going to be beneficial to me she goes hey do this yeah cold cold water tree I'm going to start doing cold buckets oh yeah yes mornings you know just trying um cold shock therapy can actually be really good for the brain so yeah reset the uh the immune system yeah there was um the ice bucket challenges for like also doing that just for like cold therapy yeah yeah and um no that's great it's always good to see that you know and when you know when you make make these big changes in your life and you have a lot of very positive Health outcomes it's very natural for people around you to notice that and pay attention and to sort of you know pick it up another thing as well like emotionally because my family had a big rift because of something that happened in the past and everyone was holding on to it um because of me potentially dying they started to connect again so my mother and my grandmother they reconnected and that's kind of been healed because of you know almost losing uh someone very precious to all of them I'm glad I could be that kind of that kind of focal point um by people going def is Def is actually a female can occur at any point so why hold on to our uh our pain and suffering and our anger and our hatred yeah I've had to forgive a lot of things that I did in the past because I was quite a misery and when I was young and I decided that none of that was actually me I was actually in my core I was a very nice person I just I was acting out because I needed attention and I blamed everybody else for my problems for my choices you know it was all me choosing to do things there was no one else forcing me yeah that's that's the same thing you know this it's a choice to remain addicted to carbohydrate and to remain addicted to news social media all these things negative impacts you know we're always watching the news I haven't watched the news in uh like six years occasionally I pick up bits of news it's like all covert happening I was like when did that happen because I wasn't paying attention to to what was going on around me because why why do I want to listen to all the negativity yeah okay in a while like I'll read some things and I'll try to keep you because I want to keep a prize of some things but you know when it's it's 24 hours a day just the same you know just just shock headlines that are just trying to just grab your attention grab your your anger and your ire and I just don't have time for that it's not it's not reporting sensationalization and and editorialization they're just you're just you know people just slinging calling names they're just like just tell me what happened and I'll decide if that person is you know beyond contempt or not you don't have to tell me they're beyond contempt I can I can do that one out myself thank you but yeah I've uh that's pretty bad so you're saying that the the code restrictions are still pretty much enforced there I heard that well I know it's it's within within the hospital I'm I'm at the um they still suggest wearing masks um getting vaccinated and all this stuff um exempt I have to say um yeah it's it's just it's everything's slower now because um the Tory government is trying to sell it off to America the NHS you know they're they're trying to privatize it um and it's like the single best thing about the United Kingdom it's like the only thing that it has going to try and get treatment or you know MRI scams because I can't afford to do that they'd have to subsidize my inability to afford it or I die because of their negligence basically so I don't know what's going on I just know that um takes a long time to get any correspondence right yeah that's because they're restricting what they can do within their system their Healthcare System right okay well hopefully we get you the information that you need obviously you do need it that's um that's one of the things with uh you know with the the system here as well in Australia the public system is that uh these sorts of cases where someone has a you know life-threatening issue they get they get handled pretty pretty well um yeah that's um that's another thing because I've I've outlived the terminal diagnosis even though it's still a terminal cancer um I don't think they prioritize that anymore they see me as a prolonged patient you know someone who's uh it's non-car terminal cancer oh Jesus okay well it's um it's you know there were some issues in in Ireland as well when I was there and here we can you know if you're if you're sort of in a category three and you're not you know life and limb sort of threatening emergency then it could be years literally it's a four and a half year waiting list to get in to see uh Us in neurosurgery if it's not life-threatening wow and if it is life-threatening it's like a category one which is like you know June we're like we can get them in you know a week or two and get surgery or just kind of have them just come to the hospital and we have we have a lot more privileges that way yeah when I was in Ireland it was not the case it was um didn't matter what it was didn't matter how severe it was didn't matter how serious it was it was a minimum two years wait to get in to see a specialist and so your your your GP could say look I think you have a brain tumor you got cancer you need to see a brain surgeon it's like yep I mean two years and then you come in to see us and it's two years and we say okay like that is almost Paramount to murder you know if they die in that time it's because they didn't didn't see this patient well that's it and if it is a tumor I mean they're not going to last that long and so they're just going to get worse and get worse and get worse and they get extremely disabled and family comes in brings them into the emergency department and they're not really able to speak and they can't move properly they don't understand you know English anymore and they you know can't control their their urine and feces and um and then you you sort of get another scan and and um and then if unless you could you know really show that this person was going to Cone they're going to die in the next sort of few weeks if you didn't then you still had to tell them to wait and so obviously with a high grade sort of stuff you know it's uh it's a bit different but um like I had one I had one patient I remember I was in the emergency department there and uh this lady came in it was like it was classic cerebellar you know sort of symptoms and so you're talking about like oh you know she always sort of like Falls over and all the kids are saying oh Grandma you're drunk grandma grandma you're drunk but she doesn't drink and and she always you know leans off I was like does she always well does she fall to both sides she followed she always falls to the right I'm like oh [ __ ] all right she's got she's got like a tumor in her cerebellum and um and they wouldn't do a scan it wouldn't let us do a scan either they had to be it had to be a specialist it wouldn't you wouldn't they wouldn't let the emergency department do any specialized scans like a CT certainly not an MRI that was never going to happen and um and so we couldn't get a scan for her but because they were waiting and they've been waiting for you know I think close to a year at this point um they said okay well they went to like Romania and or some you know other Eastern European country um and they went and got a an MRI there and they brought it back like oh you have it like oh they do have it brought it back sure enough boom little golf ball right in there enter right cerebellum and I was just like [ __ ] but because we had the you know that MRI like she didn't have that she would have been Sol she's like no wait wait your turn um but because of that you know I was able to talk to the nurseries okay we're gonna figure it out we're gonna we should be able to get her in and things like we need to do something yeah yeah it's very difficult it's very difficult sometimes you know even in those situations so thankfully that you know the NHS doesn't seem to be um like that Australia is definitely not like that Australia can can really move quickly in those threatening emergencies which I which I think is is great um but uh yeah it's you know the the ones that take longer like you know the less less threatening ones those are years it takes years and years and years and uh some of the times I tell you I tell people you know well it might be in your best interest to you know maybe see a private surgeon um because some of these things are just getting a laminectomy a simple decompression of a pensioner or um it's not all that expensive in as far as neurosurgery is concerned you know it's like 12 15 000 Aussie dollars and um but you know the the pain there is debilitating and they're on disability because they can't work because they're in so much pain and they're so many people are on disability and not working for five or five years five or six years before they get surgery and that whole time they're not working they're not making anything they're just sort of speaking an existence on um you know on the dull and disability um whereas if they were able to just pay the 15 grand up front it would have been back to work you know two months later and Jesus sorry a lot of suffering for nothing yeah yes you know and and you know yeah I think it's weird from the system point of view as well because like you know the government's losing tax revenue on that you know these people are not working now and and they're also having to pay disability and that's because the government doesn't want to pay 15 grand either you know and so like they're losing money it's a lose-lose situation everyone everyone yeah that's you focused on their agendas they can't see that there's a bigger picture for everybody but yeah it's very strange but um well I'm glad you were able to take you know take control of your own health and not have to rely on that and uh yeah yeah I mean when I went in and I declined gadolinium um for my MRI they were they were like retaining in my brain right if I had it for five years and then I stopped doing it because uh Andrew Scarborough shared something about getting lindium uh being a toxic matter why would I want that in my brain yeah get that out of me and obviously every time I had it I felt a bit funky I was like this isn't normal no yeah and it does build up you know I mean that's something we you know we we take into consideration as well when we're following up these long-term patients you know we we do try to minimize the amount of exposure that people have to that um but yeah some some places are just like yep you know gads can every three months and it's like it does it adds up it's very hard for your body to clear it it does it does build up so yeah well and you're doing and you're doing well so that was you know the last four years yeah I mean physically physically and functional um mentally I'm older I find I've struggle finding words because uh obviously my parietal labors where I've had two operations so um yeah it's just a case of um doing the right things repairing my brain if I can obviously a second operation converter uh the the membrane can be damaged um and heal less fast or not not at all so I've got let's try and repair that if I can by being intelligent and using my yeah this is when new things come up new research um I'm gonna start using it you know that's why I'm staying alive so they can cure me yeah right yeah and then well I hope they do um Bubble has been absolute pleasure thank you so much for your time uh how do we how do people get a hold of you what's your website and blog and uh yeah I just Pablo's brainjourney.com um can I share the links with you and then yeah I put everything here in the descriptions yeah absolutely yeah I think you're on you're on Twitter as well that's how I got a hold of you on Twitter I'm on Facebook uh Pablo's Jenny for brain cancer um got my websites quite a few things to be honest yeah I've got patreon which is something that I you know people donate it's a little bit of money at the beginning of every month that I can used to survive because of the matter where I'm kind of um on my Facebook uh blog and my personal page I'm kind of every every couple of weeks as I'm posting my PayPal Emmy to try and get people to donate as well or as much as possible so I can buy it buy electric oh interesting um yeah I'm just we're just on the edge of um survival um we prioritize Foods so when it comes to paying for bills we have less money because we all the food we need um just like it's going round around circles um [Music] um hopefully uh when I write my book and I do all the things I need to do um I can make enough money to survive without uh benefits and yeah go from there um but yeah writing a book is a painstaking process because uh yeah I struggle to find words so it's a bit frustrating sitting there for hours trying to write a book um just your journey or uh something else uh I just can't seem to find the link sorry there it is my patreon and my website um obviously my blog people can just type in Pablo Isaiah Kelly and find me on there right awesome well thanks now we'll put all those uh links in the description if people are able to talk and uh will enable to hopefully they do and hopefully you can get um uh done with your book and uh and yeah let's continue on and and yeah continue enjoying enjoying your time with your wife and kids yeah yeah thank you for having me and um yeah maybe we'll talk again in the future absolutely that's another success story yeah yeah absolutely great cool all right we'll see you next time hey guys thank you very much for taking the time out to listen to what I had to say if you like it then please like And subscribe to my YouTube channel and podcasts and if you're on YouTube then please hit that little bell and subscribe and that'll let you know anytime I have a new video out which should be every week if not more and if you could share this with your friends that would help me get the word out and let me know that you like what I'm doing thanks again guys [Music] thank you