5 Ways Carnivore Helps Autoimmune Disorders | Dr. Ashley Podcast

[Music] the entire world. 90% of the issues that doctors treat nowadays in western countries are these so-called chronic diseases. 90% of the deaths are from these chronic diseases. 74% of the deaths around the world are from these chronic diseases. If you just change people's diets, the large majority of those go away. I mean, the entire world benefits from this. Welcome to the Dr. Ashley Show. >> Welcome to the Dr. Ashley Show. I'm Dr. Ashley and today I am so honored and so very excited to welcome Dr. Anthony Chaffy to the show. Dr. Chaffi is an American medical doctor with a health optimization practice in Australia who over a span of over 20 years has researched the optimal nutrition for human performance and overall health. It is his assertion that most of the so-called chronic diseases we treat as doctors are caused by the food we eat or don't eat and can be reversed with dietary changes to a species specific diet. Specifically, he's going to talk on the carnivore diet. Dr. Schaffy, thanks for coming on the show. I really appreciate it. I know you're so busy. >> Oh, you're very welcome. I'm happy to be here. >> Well, I would love for you to start by just sharing your story with us. You're a medical doctor >> I think in neurosurgery and you know a lot about nutrition and diet specifically the carnivore diet. So can you share with us what led you to explore the connection between nutrition and chronic disease? >> Yeah absolutely. So I currently have a metabolic health practice where I go into health optimization preventative care. But one of the things that you can do when you're preventing a disease is if you apply those same principles, you actually end up reversing a lot of these diseases, the same things that you're going to prevent something or things that you avoid >> that will make you prevent something can actually bring people back as well. So that's a major part of my practice. I'm also retraining in neurosurgery as well, but I'm not done with that yet. But it is a very very uh important part of um you know my interest as a doctor. But as far as how diet and lifestyle play a role, I first discovered this because I was taking my undergraduate classes at the University of Washington in Seattle and I took a class in cancer biology. I'd already taken botney and biology classes. I already understood how plants and animals defend themselves because plants are stationary. They can't run away or fight back like animals can. So they typically use chemical defenses, basically chemical warfare, in order to stop animals and insects from eating them. They make about a million different defensive chemicals to stop uh predation. And so I knew that, but then it was never put in the context of our own human health until I was in uh cancer biology and my professor started talking to us about all these different plant toxins that were actually carcinogenic and were in plants that we would typically eat on a daily basis. So all the different fruits and vegetables, spinach and broccoli, kale and everything else were actually full of these toxins and many of these toxins were known carcinogens. And so we were very takenback by that. He said that they had already identified 136 known carcinogens just in Brussels sprouts. And what kid likes Brussels sprouts? Probably a good reason for that. They can taste this bitter horrible taste. This is which is your brain responding to chemicals in that food and saying, "Hey, don't eat this. This is bad for you." That's what animals do in the wild. They're not going around eating bitter tasting leaves and plants because their brain and tongue are sophisticated machines and they can tell them, "Hey, there's something bad in there." But mushrooms also had over 100 carcinogens and all the others had dozens if not over a hundred carcinogens as well. So, we were very blown away by this and I remember thinking in my head and I was like, "But but vegetables are still good for you though, right?" And he just sort of gave us a funny look. He said that he didn't eat salads and he didn't eat vegetables and he didn't let his kids eat vegetables. Then he said, "Plants are trying to kill you and just left it at that." I was like, "Okay, forget plants." And so, I stopped eating plants. I never felt better in my entire life. I was in my early 20s and usually you never feel better than in your 20s. But then when I there was a hard line when I started slipping off of that, I just started saying like, well, you know, dose makes a poison. Maybe it's not that big of a deal. And when I was in in Europe playing rugby, I was 25 and a half. And I started eating chicken that had some breading on it, just like just little crumbs. So not much, you know. I was thinking, well, dose makes a poison. Yeah, dose does make the poison, but the dose is that big. So I started actually not feeling great. still just eating meat, not eating plants, but just a little bit of crumbs on that chicken. And I I couldn't figure out what it was. At at 25, I felt like a superhero. At 25 and a half, I didn't. And I didn't know what the hell was going on. I thought maybe I was just getting older and that was just it. And my body is just decomposing now. And that's what we get told that we just get past a certain age and our bodies just fall apart. And that's actually not how it's supposed to be. And so I rediscovered that years later that humans just really are carnivores as a species. That's just the kind of animal that we are. It's all the best evidence shows that humans have been apex predators, top of the food chain for over 2 million years. And apex predators are by definition carnivores. And while it's safe for any animal to eat meat, it is not safe for any animal to eat any plant. And you have to be very aware of which plants you're eating. And so it sort of clicked that that's what I was doing in my early 20s was living as our biological design dictates, which is just eating meat. And I'd never felt better in my entire life. And I was always trying to figure out how to get back to feeling like that. And I said, "Right, I knew it. I knew plants were trying to kill me, get rid of these stupid things." And I just dropped them. I was never eating junk food. I've never been a junk food person. I've cooked nearly every single meal in my entire life has been a home-cooked meal. I've eaten pizza maybe once every two years, even in college. And um especially during that time I was carnivore, I didn't eat any pizza. >> So I was never a junk food person. I cooked all my meals. It was always, you know, meat and fresh vegetables and and maybe some fruit or some something miserable like that. But um you know, it's never processed junk. And I just just by dropping the vegetables and increasing the amount of fatty meat I ate in two weeks, I felt like I was 22 and a superhero again. And I just felt so good at 38 years old. I went back and started playing rugby again and felt amazing and was able to perform at the same level I did in my early 20s. I felt better at 38 than I did at 28 playing professional rugby, but not on a carnivore diet. And so then I started thinking about this from a medical perspective and I started looking at this from that standpoint. Biologically, we are carnivores. That's the kind of animal that we are and we're not living as such and we're not eating our biologically appropriate diet. So all these chronic diseases and illnesses that we have no clue what the basis for them are all of a sudden started making sense and slotting into place because you get these exact same diseases. Obesity, heart disease, diabetes, cancer, autoimmunity, arthritis, osteoporosis. All of these same diseases happen in other animals only when given the wrong diet or exposed to some sort of environmental toxin. So it clicked for me that we were poisoning ourselves with this inappropriate diet and not getting enough proper nutrition. I'll give an example in veterary medicine that we we know well about. I mean everyone knows that there's signs at the zoo that says don't feed the animals. They get very sick. >> If you if you they eat something else besides what they're supposed to eat and parks have the same sign say don't feed ducks. They can give them ducks bread. It gives them diabetes. Okay. What's it doing to you? You know, we give grains and things like that and skim milk. They used to give grains and skim milk to pigs to fatten them up. And there's papers back in the 1930s saying that the combination of grains and skim milk actually caused them to overeat even more to get the poundage up so they could get more lard out of them. What is grains and skim milk? That's breakfast cereal. We're giving this to people by the billions every morning. And we're wondering why we have an obesity epidemic. We literally did this on purpose for centuries to fatten up pigs and now we're the fat pigs. An example in veterary medicine, there are a number of diseases in livestock that are actually recognized like big head, big tongue, limp neck, crazy cow syndrome, many many more. They're named disease, but they're understood to not be diseases. They're understood to be when that animal is sort of caught in a pasture and they run out of forage and feed and they start eating plants that they're not really set up to to eat and they get poisoned. So, those are from plant poisons and it doesn't kill them, but they get sick. They get some they get these problems from these plant toxins that they're not biologically adapted to contend with. And even herbivores have to stick stay within a very narrow range of plants. They can't go outside of that or they get very sick or they can die. You get lost in the woods and you run out of food, you can't just eat any random plant. Most of them will make you sick or even kill you. The same goes for a cow. If they run out of the grasses that they normally eat or the feed that they normally eat, they start eating other plants, they can get sick or die. And some of those diseases that I named are are some of the manifestations of those toxicities. And so they figured out that these were from toxins from plants. They also found out that um cows have musculardrophe and it's the exact same presentation as human musculardrophe, but they figured out because cows are inherently valuable because if the cow dies, you know, you lose money and so it's in people's best interest to figure out what's going on and to stop it. Whereas when people get sick, it's like ah the profit incentive is is in actually treating those diseases as opposed to like getting you well. And so it's sort of skewed. So it's it's it's more valuable to people to keep livestock well. It's actually more valuable to keep humans sick because then we have to pay for medicines and things like that the rest of our lives, especially with these chronic diseases. Hey guys, just want to take a second to thank our sponsor at Carnivore Bar. I don't promote many products because honestly all you need to be healthy is to just eat meat. For those times that you're out hiking, road tripping, or stuck at work and you want nutritious snack that is just meat, fat, and salt. If you want it, the carnivore bar is a great option. So, I like this product not because it's just pure meat, but also because I want the carnivore market to thrive as well. And the more we support meat only products, the more meat only products there will be available in the mainstream. So, if this sounds like something you'd like to get behind, check it out using my discount code Anthony to get 10% off, which also applies to subscriptions, giving you 25% off total. All right, thanks guys. And so, they figured this out. They figured out that musculardrophe in cows is actually a selenium deficiency which is a micronutrient and essential mineral that is fairly deplete in much of the farmland now around the world. And um and if cows don't get enough of they get they can get musculardrophe at least in the genetically susceptible cows. And so, has anyone ever asked if human musculardrophe might be a selenium deficiency or uh a nutritional deficiency of some kind or another? They have no idea. Absolutely no idea, but they should ask that. So, you have toxicities and malnutrition. You have these animals eating the wrong thing. They're not getting the right nutritional compliments and they get these specific diseases. Yet we don't recognize diabetes, cancer, heart disease, heart failure, autoimmunity, and all these other sorts of so-called chronic diseases. You we just think they just happen. We don't know what they are. But every decade, they get more and more prevalent, and they get more and more common in younger and younger and younger people, right? So that's environmental. That can't be genetic. It's not just supposed to happen to us. It is abnormal. we are doing something to ourselves that is different than we used to do in previous generations and we're getting sick as a result of that. So I think that is very clear the exact same thing. So I think all those so-called chronic diseases are not diseases per se. They're like in the animals. They're a combination of toxicities and malnutrition. Toxic buildup of a species inappropriate diet and a lack of species specific nutrition. namely too many plants that we're not designed to eat and not enough meat and animal fats which we are designed to eat and we and we require for a healthy life. And so when I figured all this out and I started applying this to my patient population, I started seeing reversals and recoveries from diseases that if you ask any mainstream doctor now, they will say that is impossible. That cannot be reversed. That is a chronic progressive disease that only gets worse. That's what my mom's doctor said to her when we reversed her diabetes six years ago. And she was at least open-minded enough and clever enough as a doctor that she said, "How the hell did you do this? What the hell did you do? This doesn't happen. I want to know what you did because no one has ever done this." Right? I mean, people have, but you know, it doesn't really happen. She told her about, you know, the work I was doing and my thoughts on it. and she was like, "Okay, I'd really like to know more about this." We had a long conversation. She started applying this to her patients. She started getting the same results. And now we have clinical trials in humans showing that you can absolutely reverse type 2 diabetes by putting people on a highfat meat-based ketogenic diet. And now it's happening in the tens of thousands in clinical settings. And we're publishing this data as well. So diabetes is not a disease. It's carbohydrate toxicity. And basically, it's food poisoning. You're getting bad food. is poisoning your body and you're getting the manifestations of that poison. So that's that's sort of my main bent and goal now as a doctor is to try to educate people and get this information out there so that you don't need doctors. You don't need me to give you medications or anything like that. you can just be healthy and then doctors can get back to doing what doctors are supposed to be doing, which is dealing with what we've been dealing with for thousands of years, which is accidents and emergencies, child birth and delivery, congenital and genetic defects and and changes and infectious disease and toxicities. We're basically basically the main say what we're doing is toxicities, but should be incidental toxic exposures like a snake bite, a spider bite, right? you know, some weird lead paint or something like that gets in your soup for some reason. All these other sorts of weird accidents, not just this chronic, you know, progressive ongoing disease that affects the entire world. 90% of the issues that doctors treat nowadays in Western countries are these so-called chronic diseases. 90% of the deaths are from these chronic diseases. 74% of the deaths around the world are from these chronic diseases. If you just change people's diets, the large majority of those go away and the I mean the entire world benefits from this. People live longer, they're healthier, they're happier, they're more productive, they're stronger members of the community, they can be more productive in the economy. Everybody wins. It's a win-winwin situation. So that's that's sort of my uh my mission now is to get that out there. >> Big food and big pharma don't win, though. That's a problem, >> you know. Yeah. And that and that's the thing. And so that's that's who we're fighting at the moment. You know, big pharma. They had um there was a a slide from a Goldman Sachs meeting that got leaked that said asked the question, is it a viable business model to cure someone of disease? And of course, the answer is no. Because if you cure, you can only cure them once. You give them you give them a pill or something and it's gone now. >> Well, then that's it. You know, a c a patient cured is a customer lost. Whereas if you treat the symptoms and you help them manage that disease, well that they can manage that disease the rest of their now much shorter and more miserable life. But when you consider the fact that from the for Harvard School of Public Health they published um data on just five chronic diseases. So um diabetes type one and type two, cancer, cardiovascular disease, uh COPD and mental health is uh disorders. Uh just those five. So I mean autoimmunity and all these other sorts of things which are hugely expensive and and a very large burden. Just those five. They found that in 2010 worldwide we spent uh seven and a half trillion dollars trillion with a t on the direct and indirect cost but that's going up to uh almost $14 trillion by 2030 which is not that far away. >> And then they looked at it from other angles as well. They looked at it from the lost opportunity cost. People that are sick, they're having sick days, they're on, you know, disability leave, all these other sorts of things. So, they're not being able to be active members in the economy. And the and the world economy took a $46 trillion hit in that 20-year time frame between 2010 and 2030 or is expected to. >> And then the biggest cost was the premature deaths, the cost to the economy from premature deaths. So people having a heart attack and dying in their 30s, someone having a you know um a major stroke or some sort of uh you know dying from the complications of diabetes or multiple scerosis or or well not multiple scerosis but COPD um because they weren't looking at MS in this in this study but so just those five chronic diseases and the deaths that happen and what that loss of the economy and what they would the impact that would have from losing them for the rest of what would have been their life. That was estimated to be around $23 trillion in in 2010 alone >> and it's going to go up to uh nearly $43 trillion a year each and every year in 2030. So you're you're talking about losing $60 trillion from the economy um that could be going into much more useful directions. I mean that's going to sink any system on Earth. Earth. I mean, you know, screw healthare system. It'll it'll sink government institutions. It's just going to sink entire societies. And, you know, the amount of money that we're spending on this and then losing from the economy is just staggering. And so, the big food companies, they make several trillion dollars a year selling us this poison. >> And then the the pharmaceutical companies and the medical establishment makes, you know, tens of trillions of dollars. um well, you know, 10 to 14 trillion dollars a year um treating all these problems. But the added cost to that is another $43 trillion in early deaths and another two three four trillion a year in lost opportunity costs. So it's it's a it's a losing equation. So they're making x trillions, but we're losing far more um from the from the damage that's causing us. So whether they like it or not, we have to change it. And the thing is is that when you do change something, the great thing about, you know, >> a free market economy is that okay, well that's where the market's shifting. We don't need that anymore. They're going to have to pivot. And they don't pivot, they go away. Good. Good riddance. You can't pivot and you can't provide something beneficial to people and not just, you know, help people limp along and and cover up the symptoms of a disease instead of curing a disease, you deserve to go away, you know, but people I mean there's still a use for medicine. I still prescribe medications. I still, you know, use, you know, traditional alipathic methods. Um, and and there will always be a need for that. It's just going to be in a different direction. And so, they're going to need to pivot. If they are trying to hold still, then you know, we just need to get this uh out to as many people as possible so they're healthy and they're thriving. And then if they're too too brittle, then they'll break and you know, good riddance at that point. >> Hey guys, just a quick reminder about Glucco Cut Plus, my specially formulated supplement to support your metabolism throughout your fat loss journey. With patented ingredients, it aids in consistent weight loss and boosts energy by supporting your thyroid, burning fat, and maintaining lean muscle mass. You know, weight loss can stress your body, but I created Glucco Plus to have your back. Visit drashleywwellness.com and use code ashley10 for a 10% off your first purchase or 20% off your first subscription order with free shipping. Plus, enjoy a 30-day money back guarantee. Back to the show. So the answer is for us to go back to our species specific diet and according to your research that's the carnivore diet. So for someone new to the carnivore diet, what can we eat? What should we be eating? And are there some better veggies than others or really do we just need to wipe out veggies altogether? >> Well, yes. So that's the thing is uh you know some things are better than others. I mean, obviously, like I said, you know, there's 400,000 nearly 400,000 plant species in the world that we know of. Nearly every single one of those will kill you or make you extremely sick. So, those are obviously worse, but then there's other ones that, you know, we aren't as bad that you can sort of eat straight. There's some that we eat that we have to actually treat in certain ways, like you have to ferment it. Fermentation process we've been using for thousands of years to lower the toxic load and open up the bioavailability of many of the nutrients. And so that's very important. That's what ruminant animals like cow, bison, and and sheep do is they have they have a a for gut that fermentss that plant material first and then they they absorb now much more nutritious uh feed and also they break down fiber into uh fat and protein. So that's a big big thing that people don't realize as well that >> cows and and herbivores they they eat grass and plants, but what they absorb is fat and protein. And that's what all animals need is fat and protein. So that's a major one that plants don't really have fat and protein. Humans aren't able to convert plant tissue into animal tissue or into fat and protein. So it's it's very difficult to extract the nutrients you need. Um some some other plants that we eat, you know, but bitter cassava that will kill you. It has so much cyanide in it if you eat it straight. So they have to have special chemical treatments and different traditional ways of treating it that that lower that cyanide load. Um things like corn used to never be eaten straight. It was never eaten on the cob. The people in Meso America they would uh prepare it was like a sevenstage um treatment process called nishtomalization where they would you know crush it up expose it to other chemicals like lie and other things and um this would lower the toxic load and bring out more available nutrients. So through technology we've been able to figure out how to more safely eat plants in times of of you know privation. But it's not ever going to be optimal. Not in our lifetime anyway. Um maybe in hundreds of thousands of years if we go in that direction. But um it's through technology we've been able to make make more plants um safer to eat. Beans have tons of lectins. If you ate like raw red kidney beans, it could kill you. As little as five uh red kidney beans eaten uncooked or undercooked have put people in the hospital. And that's according to the WHO. There's a whole page on the WHO. And the WHO is no friend to to the meat diet, but they have a whole page about uh called natural toxins in food. And so it's all the different foods that we eat and all the different toxins that exist in them. And not as a single mention of any toxin in meat. So it's all in plants or in mushrooms or in algae, which can then get into seafood and things like that, but it's the algae that's poisonous. And so yes, some things are better than others, but all plants have toxins and all plants have have some ability to defend themselves. And so if you are eating those plants, some people are going to have a bit more defenses against it. People from European descent or certain parts of Asia or North Africa, um parts of Meso America, they would have been exposed to certain plants for several thousand years. But while they would have built up some defenses towards these toxins, it's certainly not complete. And so that's why you see disparities, these health outcomes. So people of European descent have certain rate of diabetes and heart disease and cancer, but people from other ethnic backgrounds like Native Americans, far higher rates of these chronic diseases, diabetes, and so forth because they were hunter gatherers up until 150 years ago. And then we wiped out the bison population, especially in Central North America. That was the main state of their diet, nutrition, and now they don't have it anymore. It was just this hardline push over into post-aggricultural society. And in the fossil record, everywhere you look and every when you look, when a population went from pre-aggricultural to a post-aggricultural society, there was a sharp decline in the height, brain size, and health of those skeletons. They usually drop by about 5 or 6 in. The brain size dropped by 11% for men and 17% for women. That's immediate. That doesn't take hundreds of years or thousands of years. That was overnight. Every time in every place that people moved to agriculture, regardless of the type of crop they moved to, they also had signs of poor wound healing, poor dentition, smaller jaws, crooked teeth, which is not genetic. That's actually a nutritional deficiency that's been proven in uh by Weston A. price and also in dentistry journals. Now, they talk about how this is not genetic. This is nutritional deficiencies that specifically coming from more of the fat soluble vitamins like vitamin K2 that only exists in animal fat, doesn't exist in plants. And so, you're not eating enough fatty meat, you're going to get crooked teeth. And so, in those populations, when you see that sharp decline in health, uh we saw that and we're we're seeing that in real time with the Native Americans, the Native Australians. We're seeing this right now with the Messiah. There's certain tribes that are transitioning, starting to eat more post-aggricultural food. There's Coca-Cola trucks coming into these remote um villages. Sometimes the only way way you can get mail or get supplies shipped in are on the Coca-Cola trucks or the only ones that actually are having, you know, roots in there. So, it's it's pretty crazy, but they're starting to get modern diseases start getting these diseases of civilization, which is what anthropologists call this. When you transition from pre-aggriculture to post agriculture, they go from having certain health issues like accidents, injuries, infectious disease to then getting uh the majority of the issues are these diseases of civilization which are these chronic diseases or really toxicities and malnutrition. And that's what the Messiah are seeing right now. We're seeing that in real time. So I think the best thing to do is just eat meat. eat what we've been eating for millions of years and you're just eating a highfat meat and water diet. That's the best. Especially ruminant meat because like I said, the ruminant animals are able to ferment and break down those toxins better. So even when they're being fed grain and things that they're not supposed to eat, >> they're better able to break that down and lower the toxic load so it doesn't get into the meat. So that's better for most people. But really, it's just eat any meat that you enjoy, that makes you feel the best, and that you can afford and have access to. And >> fish, >> fish definitely. Yeah. Any animal, >> any animal that that we >> No, dairy though. >> Dairy is a bit of a a gray area. Usually people do great with butter, but >> dairy has um a lot of really good nutrients, but it doesn't have complete nutrition. you do need other things as well. But it also has it's also a very big difference between raw dairy and and pasteurized dairy. >> Um, but it also has uh something called quazomorphins which are chemicals that actually trigger a hunger response and and want you know they >> the little baby mammal wants to drink more and more and more. So compels them and encourages them to eat more and to and to grow faster. So it can actually cause us to overeat as well. And so this is actually why farmers used uh skim milk which was a byproduct of a waste product really of the butter and cream industry that they would give that to um pigs and they found that the combination of grains and um skim milk the combination of that would cause them to overeat more than each one individually. Carbohydrates will make you overeat because it raises your insulin and that blocks leptin which is our satiety hormone. So we don't know when we're done eating and drops your blood sugar. So then you feel tired and you want to eat again. But also these quesomorphines which are in milk trigger this eat response and so they you just eat more and more and more. So, when people are trying to lose weight, especially dairy is one of those things that it's a good idea to cut out because it's a classic weight loss stall and it's one of those things that you can keep eating more and more. If you're just eating what you're designed to eat, like every animal on Earth, your internal mechanisms and signals should tell you how much to eat and when to stop. >> And if you're eating carbohydrates, it'll change your hunger signals like I mentioned. And if you're eating dairy, it'll also do that with the quasomorphine. So if you're only eating meat, you can listen to your hunger signals. If you add in dairy, unfortunately, you you might overeat and often people do. And then the carbohydrates and milk, you really want to avoid for that same reason that you want to avoid the grains because it raises insulin, drops your blood sugar, blocks leptin, all these sorts of things will cause you to overeat. And it also when your insulin is up, your metabolism is down. Insulin forces energy into cells. It doesn't allow it to come out of cells. And so if your insulin gets high enough, you cannot burn fat. And so you want to keep that insulin down at a normal level. More importantly, besides just locking in your fat cells, insulin affects over 100 different mechanisms in your body, your physiology, and your metabolism. So it's really important to keep that at normal levels. And when you elevate it with carbohydrates, then all of these other mechanisms are out of balance. And this is actually the stem of a lot of chronic diseases that we talk about, which again, they're not diseases. It's just you're poisoning yourself and your body mechanics aren't working properly. Um, so I think one of the most important things is what not to eat as opposed to what to eat. So what to eat, you just eat meat until it stops tasting good. And you do that, you know, at least once a day. And if you're trying to put on weight, you do it try to do it twice a day. But then what not to eat. So my hard rule for myself is no plants or mushrooms, no sugar or any sweeteners, and nothing artificial. And that will go for sauces, seasonings, and drinks as well. So that's if you want to do it really, really strict and really pure. And that is where I see you know, people get the best results. But you know, if you want to add in something, you can do that. You know, the idea behind this sort of diet is an elimination diet. And you're eliminating out all these possible harms and then you can add some back in. You know, if you think that you might do well with, you know, a bit of spinach or lettuce or a tomato or something like that, you know, give it 30 days, give it 90 days, get it out of your system, see how you feel, then add it back in and see how you feel. I guarantee you, you will see a difference. And I don't like that difference. So, I don't touch this stuff. Um, certain things are worse, different things that we have to chemically prepare. Obviously, they have more toxins in them. And depending on how you prepare them, you're going to get different amounts of that toxic load out of there. Um, night shades are definitely ones to avoid. So that's potatoes, tomatoes, eggplants, and capsicums, peppers. Um, I would avoid anything with carbohydrates, any grains, seeds, nuts, beans, legumes, because those are a plant's baby. A seed is a plant's baby, and everything protects its babies more than anything. And so that's where you typically find the highest concentration of toxins. If you're going to have fruit, people say, "Well, plant wants you to eat fruit because it wants to move your seed." Well, it wants something to eat fruit, not necessarily you. A lot of these fruits and berries have co-evolved with other birds and animals that um that that uh are specially designed and adapted to eat those fruits. Um a casery bird is a tropical bird. They eat 150 different fruits and berries. They're fugeores. They only eat fruits and berries. And every single one of those fruits will kill you. Every single one of those fruits will kill every single animal except the casawary bird because those seeds won't germinate unless they go through the digestive tract of the casawary bird. And so it's very important for the plant to be very attractive to the casawary bird and very detrimental to anything else trying to eat it because that is its baby. That's the next generation. And so if a casawary bird leaves an area or dies out, those plants die out. So it's very important that nothing else eats those those fruit. And um but there there's so much more. I mean, we eat grapes, we eat avocados, we say, "Oh, but those are good for you, right? Those aren't bad." Well, they'll kill cats and dogs, right? So, obviously, there are toxins in grapes and in avocados. And in fact, there are far more toxins when the fruit is green because obviously the seed's not ready yet. And so, it's it doesn't want anything eating it. So, it has far more toxins. And then as it ripens, the plant actually pulls out the toxins. If you pick it green and let it ripen in a box, those toxins just stay there. They don't just break down and degrade. >> It has to be pulled out by the plant. And so studies have shown, at least in tomatoes, when you pick them green, >> they don't actually detoxify in the box. They have the same toxic load when they're green as when they're ripe. And the traditional >> Yeah. And the traditional way of making pasta sauce was >> Yeah. You vine ripen them. You dip them in boiling water to blanch them. Take off the skin. That's barrier protection. That's where more of the toxins are. And you take the seeds out. And then you boil a living hell out of what's remaining to try to denature a lot of these lectins and toxins that are in there. And now we're telling people, no, you want to eat them fresh and green is fine. That was the traditional folk wisdom was that green tomatoes are poisonous. I was told that when I was a kid >> and now everyone's like, oh no, it's fine. That's just a wise tale. Raw food, vegan all the way. You know, it's like, no. >> And when was the last time you you got an avocado that was picked ripe at the store? It's never it's never going to happen. You know, we're being told eat five pieces of fruit a day. And so, how do you do that year round? You ship it from the equator. You ship it from other countries that are in season where normally we would only eat fruit locally in season. They're available for a couple weeks and that's it. >> And uh and then you don't have them. You're not getting these in northern Norway >> in December. I'm sorry. Like it's just not it's not natural for you to be eating five kiwis a day in a mango. That doesn't make any sense. And in order to get those kiwis and mangoes up to Norway without spoiling, they have to be picked green. So now you're having four or five times the number of toxins that are in there and a whole bunch of sugar that we've, you know, bio-engineered these things to have, which are not natural either. So um I like to stick really strictly to just fatty meat and water. Really important to get enough fat. That's the key thing you need to get one to two grams of fat to one gram of protein. That's important. That's an important ratio. >> Um, everyone's different, but that's that's a sort of a target to aim for and then adjust for your own body. >> Um, and uh, and I really avoid everything else. I feel much better without spices, without seasonings even. And that's just me, but I've been doing this for such a long time that, you know, I I feel I know how differently I feel on different kinds of meat than if I'm eating just, you know, beef all week. I feel better than if I'm eating eggs and bacon and some beef as well. So, that's my probably longer version of uh what you asked answer to your question. >> That's great. What about fiber? Um gut health. Uh some people will experience constipation. My husband did probably 30 and then 60 days of carnivore. He had loose stools. What's happening with the gut when we make these changes? And what do you say to people who say, "Oh my gosh, we need the fiber." >> Well, yeah. If you look at animals that eat fiber, the only animal only animals that eat fibrous plants as a mainstay of their diet are able to break down and ferment that fiber. So, it's not that animal that uses the fiber, it's the microorganisms that eat the fiber. No vertebrate animal can actually break down fiber. They don't. We don't make cellulace which is breaks down cellulose. It's only the microbes that that break these things down. So like like termites don't even break it down and they have they have prozzoa in their gut that eat the the fiber and um and then produce short- chain fatty acids which are 100% saturated and then those prozzoa die off and the the bug absorbs them as protein. The cows and and horses and gorillas etc. um they all do the same thing. So they don't break down the the fiber. It's actually the microbes, their bacteria that eat the fiber and as a byproduct make saturated fat and then die off and that becomes protein. So they eat grass and leaves, but what they absorb is saturated fat and protein usually in about that ratio, 1 to two grams of fat to one gram of protein. So we don't have that ability and so we don't have any need of fiber. We used to have that ability. The appendix is a small vestigial organ may have some sort of use but it's a vestigial seeum because in other primates like chimpanzees and gorillas that appendix is actually a 4 foot long seeum and that's where all this fiber packs down and fermentss and breaks down and turns into saturated fat and protein. So we don't have that ability. We don't do that anymore and so we can't get an abundance of nutrition from eating fiber. So it's not really good for us. In fact, it's also an anti-nutrient because fiber can form soluble and insoluble fiber make a sort of a lattice and they basically make physical barrier protection between your enzymes that are trying to break down your food and the food itself. So, it's not breaking down as much food and then it's actually a physical barrier between the the lumen of your intestine and these nutrients that have been broken down. So, you're breaking down less food so you can't absorb it and then what you have broken down isn't all getting absorbed. So some studies have shown that as much as 30% of the food you eat gets blocked out from absorption if you're eating that meal with fiber. So it's an anti-nutrient. That's another way that plants defend themselves is by stopping you from absorbing as many of the nutrients. So like fetic acid, oxalates, tannins. These bind and dene different vitamins, minerals and nutrients and proteins and stop you from absorbing them or protease inhibitors that block protease from getting to the proteins to break those down into amino acids. But just fiber is an anti-nutrient because it just physically blocks the absorption of these nutrients and then they have to go into your large intestine and then the bacteria get at it and you get gas and bloating and you say, "Oh, I don't like eating meat because it upsets my stomach." Well, have you tried eating it without fiber? Because I guarantee you it's a very different experience. Um, so you don't need fiber. In fact, you don't want fiber. If you're eating high octane garbage, then sure, blocking out 30% of that garbage from going in your body is is probably a good thing. And some of these studies reflect that where they have someone on a standard American diet, they give them a fiber tablet and they find, oh, their their blood sugar is marginally lower. Great. Well, if you're blocking out 30% of the carbs you're eating, >> guess what? You're going to have less carbs in your bloodstream. Or they say, well, look at this. It lowers blood pressure. So, someone tried to to send me this metaanalysis showing that it was good for blood pressure and helped with cardioabolic diseases and specifically blood pressure. Um, but they tried to dress it up as something fancier. Um, and if you looked at the studies that they used in this meta analysis, they did drop blood pressure, but it was like by an average of 1.5 points. So, you have somebody who has a a blood pressure of 170 and you drop that down to 168.5. Like, I'm sorry. That's that's that's nothing to write home about. you're still on medication, you're still a stroke risk, you're still in trouble. So, yeah, sorry. You know, you can say, yeah, fiber in that situation with that diet um helped drop your blood pressure, but it didn't do it to any significant clinical degree. And so those studies are now meta analysis. Ah, fiber helps drop blood pressure. It's something in statistics. You look at these studies that go into a meta analysis. You say, "Oh, it's a metaanalysis. The best of the best." No. What makes a good quality meta analysis is the quality of the studies used in that meta analysis. And if those studies suck, then the metaanalysis sucks. It's called garbage in garbage out. >> The studies on fiber are they're garbage. They're garbage studies. And you know the problem with medicine, you know, even if though it is my field, like I actually have a scientific background. My father was a research physicist at the Lawrence Laboratory at University of Berkeley. He was on Louis Alvarez's Nobel Prize-winning physics team developing the bubble chamber and cracking the atom. Like, I understand how this is supposed to work. And I understand that the large majority of studies in medicine are junk. They are garbage. >> Especially nutrition. It's terrible. >> So bad. So bad. And so animal nutrition, those studies are great, but you can get genetically similar populations. You get 500 head of cattle that have, you know, similar parents and genetics. You have 500 here, 500 here, change one thing and see the difference. >> That's actually robust science. But we ignore all of the lessons that we've learned from animal nutrition, which I think are really interesting uh to go into, like the fact that you get these diseases that come from eating the wrong sort of feed. Uh but yeah, so they're junk. The studies looking at fiber and saying that they're so great are junk. They're just junk studies, junk science. U they're really not worth the paper that they're written on. And there are other studies. There's one studies with over 2,000 patients that actually showed that people that ate more fiber had more heart attacks and strokes. They died more. So that's not good. What about a controlled trial with, you know, human participants that had um symptomatic constipation and found that if you split them up into four groups, one that had the same amount of fiber and then one added more fiber, one reduced fiber, one eliminated fiber, they found that it shook out exactly the opposite of what we told that it would. People that stayed the same stayed the same. Obviously, people that ate more fiber actually got worse, got more symptomatic, got worse constipation. And the people that reduced their fiber improved improved their bloating, their pain, their constipation. People that eliminated fiber, they all eliminated their symptoms. It went away. So, the fiber was the problem there. You know, that's what better studies actually show. So, you don't need fiber. In fact, I'd argue you don't want fiber. If you're eating garbage, then sure, blocking out 30% of that garbage is probably okay. But if you're not eating hot garbage, well, then you don't want to block out the absorption. You want all those nutrients. You don't want that anti-nutritive effect. So, when I eat a steak, I want all that steak in my body. >> Your your question about constipation, that's an important one. It's funny, some people say, "Well, you're going to get constipated without fiber." And all these people say, "Ah, you're going to get diarrhea if you go on carnivore." Well, which one is it? You know, it's one or the other, right? Well, it has to do a it can be with your microbiome as that's switching over, but that typically takes few days, few weeks for that to switch over. But more commonly, it's a you got you've gotten rid of fiber and now these little things that you're eating like coffee, which most people drink coffee. Most people continue to drink coffee even when they go carnivore, and now you don't have fiber blocking up and slowing things down, >> so things move faster. So, it has a much stronger laxative effect. Um, if you're only eating meat and you're only drinking water, then it can come down to just the amount of fat that you're eating. So, if you're getting constipated, and some people mistake constipation for frequency, which is not the actual medical definition of constipation. Constipation is uh about the consistency. So, is it dry, hard, pebbly, rocky, difficult to pass stools? That's constipation according to the Bristol stool chart. So just eating meat, you're going to absorb 98% of the meat that you eat. So obviously there's very little is going to come out. You're eating a plant, 95% of that fiber. 95% has to come out, right? So if you're just eating meat, you're going to go far less often. It's going to be a far smaller volume. So it's very common that people will only need to go to the bathroom once or twice a week and have very small amount that comes out. And that's because you're not eating fiber and you don't need to eat fiber because you just waste. It's just a waste product. it just goes out, right? But if you're eating fat, then you won't get constipated. You won't get those dry, hard stools because your body has a limited capacity to absorb fat. This is another thing people say, well, okay, well, you need to eat some fat. You don't want to eat too much fat because that'll make you fat. There's no such thing because you cannot physically absorb the fat. You can absorb fat with bile. So, we make bile out of our liver, but it's a slow process. It's you make about 08 liters a day, depending on the size of the person. And that is what you need to emulsify and absorb fat through your lymphatics. You can absorb some fat without bile. Usually MCTs, medium chain triglycerides, you can absorb those just more normally, not through your lymphatics. Um, but the rest of it has to go with your bile. So after you run out of bile, and you will because you're only making 08 liters a day, then you physically can't absorb fat past, you know, some of the MCTs. So So it just goes out. And that excess fat is what actually keeps your stools soft. And since fat repels water, it goes into your colon. Your colon is supposed to desiccate and dehydrate your stools. That's what it's supposed to. You're you're you're keeping that water so that you're not wasting all this water. You need water. Animals die of dehydration all the time. So, you know, we're saying, well, you need fiber because you need to move it fast through and this get it past this evil colon that's trying to steal all the water from it, make it hard. Like that's its job. Why are we fighting our own biology and anatomy? That's what it's supposed to do. If it has enough fat in it, it can sit in your colon till Christmas. It's never going to get drier than it already is and it'll stay soft. And so if you have enough fat and you're what I mean by fat is you're eating enough as much fat as your body has the capacity to absorb and then a little bit extra. So you've saturated your body's ability to absorb fat and and then some. So you have a bit of spillover. So you know it's full. then that bit of spillover is what's going to keep your stool soft. Now, if you eat a lot more fat than your body can absorb, >> well, then you're going to get diarrhea. You know, that's the old saying. I heard it when I was a kid. I don't I hardly come across anybody else who's heard it, but you know, quicker than fat through a goose. I don't know why I only heard this and no one else has, but if you give a if you give a goose like a big chunk of fat, it'll be out of them in minutes. And so, um it's uh they just can't absorb it. And so if you can't absorb the fat, it goes through you. You remember like back in the 90s they had the um the oene chips like they had Ostra. Yeah. That fake fat that we couldn't physically absorb, right? So it's like, "Oh, you can eat all the fat that you want, but you can't absorb it." Great. And then it came off the market because it people were getting loose stools or getting diarrhea. And so they they had to put that warning label on the bottom of the chips, which is just the the the death nail for them, which was may cause anal leakage. >> Oh, yeah. >> Right. Yeah, sounds great, you know. So, that that was over, you know, before it started, but but that's what it does. So, when you have um enough fat and a little bit extra, you'll keep it soft. If you have a lot more, then you'll get loose stools. The converse of that is that you can become so constipated that you get blocked up in sort of a pseudo obstruction and then the liquid stool from your small intestine can actually >> push around the outsides and you get watery diarrhea in intermix with every few days you get this hard horrible constipated stool and that's called overflow diarrhea or spurious diarrhea and that means that you're so constipated that you're you're approaching a blockage and you really need to ramp up the amount of fat that you're eating. So, if you're ever constipated, by definition, you're not eating enough fat. Um, if you're eating way too much protein as well, that can cause sort of watery stool. So, it's sort of a U-shaped curve. It's too little fat, you'll get diarrhea. Too much fat, you can also get loose stools as well. So, you want to get that Goldilocks uh amount of fat and just the just right one. Hey guys, thank you very much for taking the time out to listen to what I had to say. 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